The real questions are

[I-AM-THAT-I-AM]

Is Obama The Real Manchurian Candidate?

Considering Barack Obama was born a Muslim and now claims to be a Christian "his affiliation is to a extreme racist sect of the Christian religion", could it be possible that he was groomed by our enemies to infiltrate the government and acquire the highest office in the United States of America.

Also consider the democratic party and it's affiliation with the Communist party, and consider the Possibility that the Communist party has connections to the N.A.A.C.P. as well.

Could the democrat's have motives that are directly opposed to the Constitution of the United States of America, and plan a complete and hostile take over of our form of government?

http://www.postchronicle.com/commentary/opinion/article_21219819.shtml

[9sublime]

Can you please cite some sources for these claims?

1. Obama is part of an extreme racist sect
2. Democrats affiliation with the communist party
3. NAACP's affiliation with the communist party.

Do you still have the same warped mindset that people had in the 30's about change? Communism, foreign, root of all evil. Blacks, don't look like us, root of all evil. Blacks therefore are all communists. All communists want to destroy America in conjuctions with the Muslims and Hispanics by taking down Christianity.

[Bunz]

IamthatIam,
Firstly, welcome. As per your thread, I think the same likely hood of this as the same likely hood of when JFK was elected and there were charges he would take orders from the Vatican. That obviously did not turn out to be true during the short time Kennedy was in office.
I find it somewhat ironic the fact you point out the color of his skin and the religion he was born into. Obama like everyone else, has no say whatsoever in the color of skin he was born with, or the religion his parents chose to believe in before he was old enough to make that decision objectively on his own.
Could the democrat's have motives that are directly opposed to the Constitution of the United States of America, and plan a complete and hostile take over of our form of government?
Suuuure....you know that sounds like the GOP to me in January 01.
As for any conspiracy theory...if that is what the democrats desired, why wouldnt they have done it earlier under Clinton, or Kennedy/Johnson, or even better, with FDR. This notion in my opinion is slightly amusing but mostly partisanship of its most absurd.

[ilikeboobs]

I have a question - isn't Obama 1/2 white?
If so, why does he fight for blacks and not whites?
Just like halle berry - she's half white but only claims the black part.
By definition, this makes them racists.
I don't want a racist running my country.

[Popeye]

I have a question - isn't Obama 1/2 white?
If so, why does he fight for blacks and not whites?
Just like halle berry - she's half white but only claims the black part.
By definition, this makes them racists.
I don't want a racist running my country.
Racist
1. a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others.

Strange, I see nothing there that makes Obama "by definition" a racist. Perhaps you could supply a link that quotes Obama stating blacks are superior to whites.

[valor]

White leaders have to fight for all nationalities, Black leaders get by with fighting for the black only, exept when they can USE other minorities in the attempt to futher the black cause.

Let's face it, blacks want to claim permanent victim status and cant stand the fact that the hispanic community has surpassed them as the majoririty within the minority community.

The black leadership has one goal, to rob whitey with the help of the liberal left.

I have no problem with any other minority or group of people, the black cuture is a cancer to a civil society, as I said above the black leader want to rob whitey with help from the government, while the black male robs the homes of whitey.

If you think that it is just the white guys who see past the propaganda your wrong, I have have conversations with the Arab, Asian and Hispanic community and they all state the same thing when it comes to the behavior of the black community.

If you want a honest judgement of who you are ask your friends, enemies, teachers, law enforcement, family and you will get a good idea.

The evidence supports the facts, you can lie to yourselves if you wish, the black community is the biggest ploblem with our economy, all others are productive.

[9sublime]

Well its unfortunate that iamthatiam could never verify his claims.

I would also like to point out that it does not make them racist if they do not talk about their joint heritage. Stop being so picky, I have a sneaking suspcion some people have a problem with a black running the country.

[Izz]

someone stop this moron before he hurts someone with his stupidity.

[heyjude]

Well, the Democrats have a black, a woman, and a hispanic running. I am sure there are a lot of bigots getting upset. And they may just get a whole lot more upset when one of them becomes president. Any hope they will all leave the country?

[kruckenkreuz]

When I see Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama, I see satan in the flesh, both are serpants on this earth.

[Segep]

Welcome back, I-AM

[Libsmasher]

Well, the Democrats have a black, a woman, and a hispanic running. I am sure there are a lot of bigots getting upset. And they may just get a whole lot more upset when one of them becomes president. Any hope they will all leave the country?


How about the Liberal hysteria about Huckabee? The pundits blew a gasket when he mentioned Jesus. The last PC-approved bigotries: anti-white male and anti-christian.

[AlicornsPrayer]

I have a question - isn't Obama 1/2 white?
If so, why does he fight for blacks and not whites?
Just like halle berry - she's half white but only claims the black part.
By definition, this makes them racists.
I don't want a racist running my country.

Obama is indeed half-white...Also, as to his 'religious' upbringing? It's unknown as to what Obama's father's religious views were...His father originated from Kenya, which it's religion is predominantly Islamic. Obama's mother was Christian.

But here's the thing...Obama wasn't raised with his father's influence period. Obama's parents divorced when Obama was 2 years old...His father moved back to Kenya and had absolutely no with Obama's upbringing. Obama was raised as a Christian, by his mother and mother's family. And the only information he knew about his father, was through stories and pictures shown to him, by his mother/mother's family.


At no time, was Obama raised as 'Muslim', because his influence in his life was his mother's beliefs. His father had no active part in raising Obama...No visitation (except once), no phone calls, a complete absentee father. Again, Obama knew nothing about his own father, except through pictures and stories told to him by his mother and mother's family...Again, all of them being Christians themselves...Obama was raised Christian, hence the reason he IS and has always been Christian.

Another falsehood told about Obama is that he had an Islamic education...That he attended an Islamic school...Which is a distortion/untruth about his early educational experience.

Obama's mother remarried when he was 4. Her husband was a foreign student, and their family was moved to Jakarta, Indonesia. Again, a predominantely Islamic nation...

But Obama didn't attend a 'private Muslim school' as has been implied, to further his supposedly 'Muslim upbringing'...

No, he attended a public school, where the staff and student body were comprised of Islamic, Christian, Catholic, Buddhist, and Hindu children/staff...Again, in no way was it a 'Muslim' school nor did that school promote 'Muslim beliefs/practices' as has been implied by those trying to feed on the fear of terrorism, by implying that Obama is a supposed 'terrorist' or holds 'terrorist ties'...

It's dirty politics at play period. Lying about Obama's heritage to try and foster false fear in a canidate through those lies and false 'information'.

[AlicornsPrayer]

Well its unfortunate that iamthatiam could never verify his claims.

I would also like to point out that it does not make them racist if they do not talk about their joint heritage. Stop being so picky, I have a sneaking suspcion some people have a problem with a black running the country.


You spoke my mind...You hit the nail on the head with this post.

[Libsmasher]

The author above is ignoring Obama's mother's second marriage, to a muslim named Lolo Soetoro, with whom Obama lived for several years while growing up, before his mother got divorced. Obama spent most of his childhood growing up in Indonesia, the world's largest islamic country. None of this may have affected Obama's belief system, but let's tell the WHOLE truth, shall we?

Obama describes life with his stepfather in his autobiography:

"With Lolo, I learned how to eat small green chili peppers raw with dinner (plenty of rice), and away from the dinner table, I was introduced to dog meat (tough), snake meat (tougher), and roasted grasshopper (crunchy)," Obama wrote. "LIke many Indonesians, Lolo followed a brand of Islam that could make room for the remnants of more ancient animist and Hindu faiths. He explained that a man took on the powers of whatever he ate: One day soon, he promised, he would bring home a piece of tiger meat for us to share."

Ugh! :eek:

[AlicornsPrayer]

The author above is ignoring Obama's mother's second marriage, to a muslim named Lolo Soetoro, with whom Obama lived for several years while growing up, before his mother got divorced. Obama spent most of his childhood growing up in Indonesia, the world's largest islamic country. None of this may have affected Obama's belief system, but let's tell the WHOLE truth, shall we?

Obama describes life with his stepfather in his autobiography:

"With Lolo, I learned how to eat small green chili peppers raw with dinner (plenty of rice), and away from the dinner table, I was introduced to dog meat (tough), snake meat (tougher), and roasted grasshopper (crunchy)," Obama wrote. "LIke many Indonesians, Lolo followed a brand of Islam that could make room for the remnants of more ancient animist and Hindu faiths. He explained that a man took on the powers of whatever he ate: One day soon, he promised, he would bring home a piece of tiger meat for us to share."

Ugh! :eek:

Obama only lived from ages 4-10 in Indonesia...The rest of the time, he grew up in Hawaii, till he went to college on the main land here in the states. 6 years doesn't constitute 'the most of his childhood' period. Ages 1-4, and 10-18 in Hawaii is 12 years growing up here in the US, with his grandparents and mother. Of who, like I said, were Christian.

So again...The truth of the situation is being exaggerated about his supposed 'Muslim' upbringing in order to foster fear in the voter...Period.

And sorry darling...But the idea of that the type of meat you eat, brings that animal's powers into yourself isn't 'Islamic'...In fact, it's a very pagan rooted belief that is found alot within the Native American teachings, as well as in Asian-Buddhist/Hindu/Taoims/Dharmic traditions.

The Chinese and Japanese (which the majority are Buddhist) are the biggest/best known societies today that incorporate that belief into their every day living practices...In fact they sell/prepare herbals, teas, etc. containing exotic animal parts for those specific 'cures/endowments'.

Other traditions/cultures/practices that incorporate this ideology are Romani, Vodun, Shinto, Druidism, etc...Just to name a few that is.

From the portion you quoted, what he was describing was traditional Hindu ideology and is supported by his comments about his step-father incorporating 'more ancient and Hindu faiths' into his own...More ancient then Hindu. Simply because although Hinduism doesnt' say it's wrong to eat meat, most meats are taboo except for mutton, chicken, and fish...

Islamics on the other hand, share the same taboos about meat that Judaism has...which it is taboo to have eaten the meats by Islamic ideology, that Obama mentions they had had...Which actually is a more Asian Buddhist ideology at work...What you eat, endows you with it's powers. :D And dog is a favored specialty in that area of the world...As is snake and grasshoppers...All fair game/food...

Only in Western Civilization is eating dog outlawed, although the other mentioned foods are eaten as delicasies in the West...

Now the Tiger is different, as Western Civilizations have outlawed eating extinct/near extinct species...But in Asian and Middle Western Cultures? That's a whole different kettle of fish, so to speak...As although it's looked down upon because of extinct species subject, their goverments don't exactly enforce laws against doing so for their citizens.

[uguysarfruts]

Obama only lived from ages 4-10 in Indonesia...The rest of the time, he grew up in Hawaii, till he went to college on the main land here in the states. 6 years doesn't constitute 'the most of his childhood' period. Ages 1-4, and 10-18 in Hawaii is 12 years growing up here in the US, with his grandparents and mother. Of who, like I said, were Christian.

So again...The truth of the situation is being exaggerated about his supposed 'Muslim' upbringing in order to foster fear in the voter...Period.

And sorry darling...But the idea of that the type of meat you eat, brings that animal's powers into yourself isn't 'Islamic'...In fact, it's a very pagan rooted belief that is found alot within the Native American teachings, as well as in Asian-Buddhist/Hindu/Taoims/Dharmic traditions.

The Chinese and Japanese (which the majority are Buddhist) are the biggest/best known societies today that incorporate that belief into their every day living practices...In fact they sell/prepare herbals, teas, etc. containing exotic animal parts for those specific 'cures/endowments'.

Other traditions/cultures/practices that incorporate this ideology are Romani, Vodun, Shinto, Druidism, etc...Just to name a few that is.

From the portion you quoted, what he was describing was traditional Hindu ideology and is supported by his comments about his step-father incorporating 'more ancient and Hindu faiths' into his own...More ancient then Hindu. Simply because although Hinduism doesnt' say it's wrong to eat meat, most meats are taboo except for mutton, chicken, and fish...

Islamics on the other hand, share the same taboos about meat that Judaism has...which it is taboo to have eaten the meats by Islamic ideology, that Obama mentions they had had...Which actually is a more Asian Buddhist ideology at work...What you eat, endows you with it's powers. :D And dog is a favored specialty in that area of the world...As is snake and grasshoppers...All fair game/food...

Only in Western Civilization is eating dog outlawed, although the other mentioned foods are eaten as delicasies in the West...

Now the Tiger is different, as Western Civilizations have outlawed eating extinct/near extinct species...But in Asian and Middle Western Cultures? That's a whole different kettle of fish, so to speak...As although it's looked down upon because of extinct species subject, their goverments don't exactly enforce laws against doing so for their citizens.

You obviously need to move to Africa and become a victim of your stupidity, if you are white, you are a race traitor, and when i think of people like you, I think of fish food.

[AlicornsPrayer]

You obviously need to move to Africa and become a victim of your stupidity, if you are white, you are a race traitor, and when i think of people like you, I think of fish food.

ROTFLMAOL!!!

In otherwords, you didn't like the fact that the other poster's falsehoods about a canidate was just that...Falsehoods. So the only retort you have, is to hurl insults towards me, depending on whether I'm black or white?

Sorry that you can't handle facts and rather support innuendos and falsehoods about another person, no matter what color thier skin color is/isn't or religious beliefs are/aren't...

And thanks for sharing with me, that you're a racist and don't have anything to contribute but racist slurs and verbal abuses to those you percieve as 'different' then your narrow-minded self.

Oh, and by the way hon?

Indonesia isn't in Africa...So your reference to Africa had not a thing to do with the topic that was being discussed. Kenya might be...But the discussion was supposedly Obama having lived in Indonesia most of his childhood...Do try to keep up with what was being discussed...

[Segep]

Reason: to stick my foot up your ass

Put that thing away before you hurt yourself.

[Libsmasher]

Obama only lived from ages 4-10 in Indonesia...The rest of the time, he grew up in Hawaii, till he went to college on the main land here in the states. 6 years doesn't constitute 'the most of his childhood' period. Ages 1-4, and 10-18 in Hawaii is 12 years growing up here in the US, with his grandparents and mother. Of who, like I said, were Christian.

1 to 12 is childhood, 13 - 19 is teenage, 20 is adulthood. He spent 8 years of his childhood with a muslim father or stepfather - you're wrong, sweets. Obama was also named after Muhammad's grandson. Prez of the United States?? C'monnnnnnnnn. :D

[9sublime]

1 to 12 is childhood, 13 - 19 is teenage, 20 is adulthood. He spent 8 years of his childhood with a muslim father or stepfather - you're wrong, sweets. Obama was also named after Muhammad's grandson. Prez of the United States?? C'monnnnnnnnn. :D

Let's say hypothetically, he spent his whole chidlhood being Muslim, and his teenage years, and maybe even a young adult. It doens't mean its impossible for him to convert does it?

Stop being so pathetic, all of you. What you are born into does not neccessarily constitute who you are.

[AlicornsPrayer]

1 to 12 is childhood, 13 - 19 is teenage, 20 is adulthood. He spent 8 years of his childhood with a muslim father or stepfather - you're wrong, sweets. Obama was also named after Muhammad's grandson. Prez of the United States?? C'monnnnnnnnn. :D

ROTFLMAOL! I see you still insist on stretching facts, simply in order to try fostering a false fear about a canidate...

Sorry darling...But in the US, if you're under 18, you're a child...Childhood may have different catagories...But a child no matter how you slice it, in a legal sense. Toddler, pre-schooler, adolecent, pre-teen, teen, adult...from Toddler to adult, all in between is childhood.

Or are we now going to play semantics cause you want to continue on with innuendos and falsehoods? You know there's a name for that...Dirty politics...When the opposition is so afraid of their opponent they have to lie about them?

Also, why mention 'father' there? I guess it goes completely over your head about his father abandoning him when he was a toddler?

Also, you seem horrible at doing math...Age 4 to 6 years old doesn't come to 8 years...It comes to 6 (SIX) years...Again, you have a need to inflate the facts to fit your agenda of dirty politicing and falsehoods.

So what of Obama's name? Hate to tell you this, but children are not responsible nor form their lives to conform to the names their parents give them...Millions of children world-wide have embarrassing names given to them from their parents...But the name doesn't make the person...The person makes the name.

And so far, you have insinuated and stretched the truth about facts concerning the person...Which doesn't fit them period, cause they are not the name or identity you are trying to attach to them through your falsehoods and insinuations.

Let's say hypothetically, he spent his whole chidlhood being Muslim, and his teenage years, and maybe even a young adult. It doens't mean its impossible for him to convert does it?

Stop being so pathetic, all of you. What you are born into does not neccessarily constitute who you are.

I happen to agree with you there Sublime. All I'm pointing out is the fact that although Obama's father was Islamic, or that he lived in a Islamic nation, or that even his name is Islamic...That Obama has always made it perfectly clear that at no time did he consider himself anything but a Christian.

And I find it perfectly distasteful that despite his consistant telling of being a Christian, that some people rather feed gossip based of of nothing more then situations/circumstances he had no control over...He had no control over who his mother married...He had no control over the name his parents choose for him...And he certainly had no choice in where his family moved him as a child...

But despite all of that, he follows a Christian belief as a child and adult. Especially in light that he, himself, discribes his religious upbringing at the hands of his mother and step-father as being more atheist/agnostic then anything else. That neither were particularly religious in any sense, quite the opposite. That he didn't really find himself, TILL he walked into a United Church of Christ in his twenties...That up til then, he really didn't have a religious identity himself, although the Christian seed was in him and just unvocalized up till then.

Personally, that's what I find pathetic in all of this...That people feel so threatened by this canidate, that instead of looking for something truthful to use against him, they rather play the gossiping and innuendo game.

We talk about how we would like to see an honest politician...But I'd go a step futher and say I'd love to see an honest voter as well...

Seems both types go hand-in-hand these days. No wonder our country is so messed up...

[numinus]

People in this thread should remember that in the exercise of suffrage, one is SUPPOSED TO DISCRIMINATE.

[Libsmasher]

ROTFLMAOL! I see you still insist on stretching facts, simply in order to try fostering a false fear about a canidate...

Sorry darling...But in the US, if you're under 18, you're a child...Childhood may have different catagories...But a child no matter how you slice it, in a legal sense. Toddler, pre-schooler, adolecent, pre-teen, teen, adult...from Toddler to adult, all in between is childhood.

And the next year, when you're 18, you can be sent to Iraq and fight in the war? :D Kind of an abrupt change from "childhood".

Also, why mention 'father' there? I guess it goes completely over your head about his father abandoning him when he was a toddler?

Also, you seem horrible at doing math...Age 4 to 6 years old doesn't come to 8 years...It comes to 6 (SIX) years...Again, you have a need to inflate the facts to fit your agenda of dirty politicing and falsehoods.

His islamic father had him from birth to age 2. His islamic stepfather had him age 4 to 10. Wanna try the math again, einstein? :D

So what of Obama's name? Hate to tell you this, but children are not responsible nor form their lives to conform to the names their parents give them...Millions of children world-wide have embarrassing names given to them from their parents...But the name doesn't make the person...The person makes the name.

Garsh, who woulda thunk it! The POINT was to indicate the influence of the people who raised him, and were islamic. Blink twice if you get it yet.

[9sublime]

Well tell me where the influence is evident in his politics? It seems to the Islamic religion has only influenced his name.

[AlicornsPrayer]

And the next year, when you're 18, you can be sent to Iraq and fight in the war? :D Kind of an abrupt change from "childhood". I agree...It is an abrubt change in status...And I find it also interesting, considering said adult can go to war and possibly die, or even enter into a marriage at age 18...But same said adult isn't considered adult enough to buy a drink in a bar or a 6-pack at the store til they're 21...

But irregardlessly, they're not considered an adult until age 18...Despite the fact that they're allowed to do certain things and denied other things based on that adult status...


His islamic father had him from birth to age 2. His islamic stepfather had him age 4 to 10. Wanna try the math again, einstein? :D

For one thing, there's no way to know IF Obama's father himself was Islamic...All we know is the fact that his father came from a predominantly Islamic country. Even then, that still doesn't hold any 'influence' as to what Obama himself was. Especially considering he wasn't born in Kenya, but in Hawaii...A non-Islamic state within a non-Islamic country...

The MOST you can say is that Obama was born in a mixed-religious family (Non-practicing Christian Mother and possibly Islamic Father) with both possible influences in his childhood. BUT, you'd rather be deceptive in that fact, ignore his Christian roots, for no other reason then to create false fear and innuendo.

And again...about the step-father...His step-father was born Muslim but himself was ATHIEST...Or if you'd perfer, AGNOSTIC in his practices. In otherwords, he was in no way a practicing Muslim and even Obama's own writtings about his stepfather point that out in how his step-father held other beliefs very contrary to his Muslim upbringing...

Again, you are being deceptive and misleading while ignoring the facts only to foster more fear and false innuendos against Obama himself.

By the way...Now you're being wishy-washy. Your original comment was that Obama lived in Indonesia and had his STEP-FATHER'S Muslim influence the majority of his life...

The author above is ignoring Obama's mother's second marriage, to a muslim named Lolo Soetoro, with whom Obama lived for several years while growing up, before his mother got divorced. Obama spent most of his childhood growing up in Indonesia, the world's largest islamic country.

Then, when I point out to you that Obama didn't spend the majority of his life in Indonesia, but Hawaii and state-side...You switch your claims to then try to include his father, while still trying to maintain that 'Obama was mainly influenced by Islam all his life'?


Garsh, who woulda thunk it! The POINT was to indicate the influence of the people who raised him, and were islamic. Blink twice if you get it yet.

What about the influence of his mother? You want to make an issue about what countries the father and step-father were from, but you totally discount where his mother was from and what her own religious influences would have been on that child?

Not to mention, you want to make some big deal out of his father's absentee influence, based on nothing more then where his father was from without any knowledge of the father's religious upbringing (innuendo only) as well as ignore the step-father's actual religious preferences of being athiest...Again, only focusing on where they were from, lived, in order to foster fear and innuendo on Obama?

And to further show just how deceptive you are about presenting facts about Obama, you are trying to insist that his name makes him Muslim, despite the fact that the name doesn't make the person or say what that individual's beliefs are? Like Obama had say or control in what name his parents gave him. ROTFLMAOL!!!

But like I said...I don't expect much more from your type then you've shown in your posts...You're into dirty politics and you really can't help yourself in playing the innuendo game in order to get people to choose your side of issues through misinformation and fear...And if there isn't any dirt about them, you're more then happy to make it up as you go along, cause nothing's worse in your mind then an informed voter...You want them as scared and paranoid as you are, in hopes they'll vote as paranoid and scared as you vote. LOL!

Just like the politicians you more then likely support. Why ever would you want to address pros-cons about a canidate's actual policies when you can engage in smear campains and gossip about them instead. LOL!

I'll be so happy when we get more canidates that not only can seperate their religions from our goverment, but that can inspire the voters to do the same...And that's half the problem with your side's mentality...You can't seperate your religious beliefs and fears, from the canidates themselves. You even got to smear your Christian canidates for no other purpose then to say they're not 'Christian enough' or 'Christian long enough'...

I'm looking forward to the day we start voting Athiests into the executive offices...So we can finally enjoy a 'goverment seperate from religion' democracy that our founding fathers dreamed of.

[heyjude]

On one hand, the conservatives rant that Obama is a Muslim, and on the other, they rant about the Christian church he attends. It is African centric and almost exclusively black. I guess some people want it both ways.

It's a little like bein Clinton. She cold and unfeminine, she's a weak woman. There is no winning with some people.

[Libsmasher]

On one hand, the conservatives rant that Obama is a Muslim, and on the other, they rant about the Christian church he attends.
.


They do? Garsh, I don't remember making either rant, and I'm conservative. :confused:

[Libsmasher]

I agree...It is an abrubt change in status...And I find it also interesting, considering said adult can go to war and possibly die, or even enter into a marriage at age 18...But same said adult isn't considered adult enough to buy a drink in a bar or a 6-pack at the store til they're 21...

That's illogical - being a private in the army during war requires ability to learn combat, take orders, strength, and fast reflexes. Drinking and marriage require maturity frequently not found in 18 year olds.

For one thing, there's no way to know IF Obama's father himself was Islamic...All we know is the fact that his father came from a predominantly Islamic country. Even then, that still doesn't hold any 'influence' as to what Obama himself was. Especially considering he wasn't born in Kenya, but in Hawaii...A non-Islamic state within a non-Islamic country...

Wrong - Obama says that his father was raised islamic. His stefather was islamic. Indonesia is an islamic country.

The MOST you can say is that Obama was born in a mixed-religious family (Non-practicing Christian Mother and possibly Islamic Father) with both possible influences in his childhood. BUT, you'd rather be deceptive in that fact, ignore his Christian roots, for no other reason then to create false fear and innuendo.

His mother was non-religious - he has no "christian roots".

And again...about the step-father...His step-father was born Muslim but himself was ATHIEST...Or if you'd perfer, AGNOSTIC in his practices.

That is false - his stepfather was neither an atheist or an agnostic. What are you going to say next - "Indonesia isn't really an islamic country"? :D

Again, you are being deceptive and misleading while ignoring the facts only to foster more fear and false innuendos against Obama himself.

No, I'm telling it like it is - you simply can't deal with the facts.

By the way...Now you're being wishy-washy. Your original comment was that Obama lived in Indonesia and had his STEP-FATHER'S Muslim influence the majority of his life...

You're hallucinating - I said no such thing.

Then, when I point out to you that Obama didn't spend the majority of his life in Indonesia, but Hawaii and state-side...You switch your claims to then try to include his father, while still trying to maintain that 'Obama was mainly influenced by Islam all his life'?

I said that he was surrounded by islamic influences growing up. The influences you have when you're growing up can last a lifetime. You are trying to evade this by a nonsensical simplistic arithmetic.

And to further show just how deceptive you are about presenting facts about Obama, you are trying to insist that his name makes him Muslim, despite the fact that the name doesn't make the person or say what that individual's beliefs are? Like Obama had say or control in what name his parents gave him. ROTFLMAOL!!!

That point apparently flew over your head at Mach 3. The point was that that such a name would be given by the father revealed the influences he would have been subject to. Get it yet? :rolleyes:

But like I said...I don't expect much more from your type then you've shown in your posts...You're into dirty politics and you really can't help yourself in playing the innuendo game in order to get people to choose your side of issues through misinformation and fear...And if there isn't any dirt about them, you're more then happy to make it up as you go along, cause nothing's worse in your mind then an informed voter...You want them as scared and paranoid as you are, in hopes they'll vote as paranoid and scared as you vote.

"blah blah blah" (yawwwwnnnn)

Just like the politicians you more then likely support. Why ever would you want to address pros-cons about a canidate's actual policies when you can engage in smear campains and gossip about them instead.

Obama doesn't have policies - just glittering generalities and claimed goals without explaining how they are to be achieved. He keeps everything vague so that everyone who is disatisfied will think he is their man.

I'll be so happy when we get more canidates that not only can seperate their religions from our goverment,

What the devil does THAT mean? Anyone's guess. :rolleyes:

but that can inspire the voters to do the same...And that's half the problem with your side's mentality...You can't seperate your religious beliefs and fears, from the canidates themselves. You even got to smear your Christian canidates for no other purpose then to say they're not 'Christian enough' or 'Christian long enough'...

Uh... I don't have any religious beliefs. Now don't you feel foolish? You certainly look foolish! :D

[AlicornsPrayer]

By the way...Now you're being wishy-washy. Your original comment was that Obama lived in Indonesia and had his STEP-FATHER'S Muslim influence the majority of his life...

You're hallucinating - I said no such thing.



LOL! Yes you did. In fact, in my post that you're responding to here, I included the exact post you said so...And HIGHLIGHTED the portion of your claim about the majority of his time being spent in Indonesia...Which you conviently overlooked in fact...To deny you said it?

Let me refresh your memory...Again...

The author above is ignoring Obama's mother's second marriage, to a muslim named Lolo Soetoro, with whom Obama lived for several years while growing up, before his mother got divorced. Obama spent most of his childhood growing up in Indonesia, the world's largest islamic country.

Remember now? I mean, you can click the little arrow next to your name in that quote, and it'll take you directly to YOUR post, where you did indeed claim that Obama had spent most of his life in Indonesia, hence his 'Islamic upbringing' you originally started out claiming...

By the way...I've stated several times, that Indonesia is an Islamic country...As well as stating similar expressions in regards to Kenya, where Obama's father came from...Would you like me to repost that for you? Since obviously you don't read what's said, or dismiss what was said in order to falsely back up your position?

So why now are you trying to pretend I think otherwise?

Oh...And from Obama's book, about his father's and step-father's supposed 'Islamic influences' on him...Which by the way...I was confusing his father with his step-father...My bad...:D

his Kenyan father was raised a Muslim, but a confirmed atheist by the time his parents met, and his Indonesian stepfather as a man who saw religion as not particularly useful.

As to his mother?

Mother was detached from religion, yet in many ways the most spiritually awakened person that I have ever known.

Either way you want to sum that up, that doesn't conclude that Obama's parents used their beliefs/non-beliefs to influence his beliefs...You may want it to appear that way...If anything, they left it up to him to choose for himself what fit him best. IF they were supposedly such an influence, you'd think he'd be Agnostic or Atheist himself...But he's Christian.

If anyone or anything was responsible for his beliefs, then it would appear that America and it's predominantly Christian culture (where he was born and has spent the majority of his childhood and adult life) was more responsible for his beliefs then any 'Islamic person or country'...Since it's as a Christian he identifies himself, not Islamic period. And American culture itself is predominantly Christian.

And back to the name thingy eh? Then how do you explain Atheists that give their children names that have a religious useage? Parents that name their children after relatives in rememberance, that have a Christian religious meaning, yet the parents themselves aren't particularly religious?

You're putting way more meaning into Obama's name then is truthful...His parents gave him a name to remember a relative. You'd like it to mean more, in order to back up your anti-Islamic views...But that's simply making a mountain out of a molehill in order to cause fear and disinformation.

And obviously, even IF your implied meaning is that Obama's name was intended to influence his beliefs? Well, then again that fails, since he's obviously Christian and doesn't hold to the Islamic ideals you'd like to make others think he holds to...

Obviously, you are religious in some sense...As it's you trying to use religious reference/inference as to Obama's intentions and goals...

Only a religous person would go to that particular point of trying to get others to focus on another's suspect religious views, in order to try and paint that person as 'suspect and possibly harmful' because of suspect religious views...

So no, I don't feel a bit foolish in lumping you into the same group as any other religious zealot who uses religion as a basis to judge another's worth/value...

And our country would be better off, if people like yourself stopped trying to use religion and faith as a means to vote/not vote people into office or to give/remove rights from US citizens. You vote people into office based on what you think they're religous beliefs may/maynot be in order to ensure the politician votes for policies that support those religious ideologies...

Otherwise, you wouldn't need to play that 'Obama is Muslim' card in the first place. Only a religious person hoping to cause fear and disinformation, would play that card.

[Libsmasher]

I think I get you now - you have a bigoted attitude against any candidate for president who has religious roots - unless they're islamic. :D

[AlicornsPrayer]

I think I get you now - you have a bigoted attitude against any candidate for president who has religious roots - unless they're islamic. :D


No on both observations...

1. I don't like canidates that use their religious ideologies as a means to making laws in regards to US citizens...Nor do I like voters that use their perferred religions to vote those politicians into office...

2. We haven't had, nor do we have any politicians that are 'Islamic' trying to run for office.

3. And IF we did have a politician who was using their Islamic religious viewpoints to create/enact laws/policies in regards to US citizens? I'd be just as quick to find them distasteful as any other politician that is using their religious beliefs to gain office and create/enact laws to reflect those religious viewpoints.

I firmly believe that religion has no place in our goverment policies nor at the voting booth.

Hence my earlier statement that I'd perfer to see an Athiest/Agnostic politician put into our goverment offices as a means to keep religion out of our laws and policies as well as I'd like to see voters move away from the religious issues and start voting for what's right for all of our people. Not just voting for those that are 'religiously appealing' to them and playing the 'what religion is the canidate' card.

But noooo...Voters like you rather play the 'this one is a better Christian, this one isn't the right type of Christian, or this one isn't really Christian' and 'ohhhh, is he wearing the lapel pin I'm wearing' cards...

Nobody cares about focusing on the issues and what canidates are doing about those issues...They'd rather focus much more on whether that canidate is the same faith as them and where they do their shopping...Then they wonder why our country is going down the tube while blaming everyone else but their own selves because they're voting on assumptions, appearances, and religious appeal.

Voters like you vote on fancy packaging, not what's in the box.

[Coyote]

No on both observations...
I firmly believe that religion has no place in our goverment policies nor at the voting booth.



Exactly. We're electing a President, not a Pope.

[Libsmasher]

No on both observations...

1. I don't like canidates that use their religious ideologies as a means to making laws in regards to US citizens...Nor do I like voters that use their perferred religions to vote those politicians into office...

Probably much of the law has it's roots in religion - there is a law against murder because people think it's wrong. There are laws to help the poor because of the influence of charity requirements of the abrahamic religions. I don't like anti-religious bigots who think they can prescribe why people should vote this or that way.

I firmly believe that religion has no place in our goverment policies nor at the voting booth.

A vague statement - nobody could decipher it. What precisely does "place" mean?

Nobody cares about focusing on the issues and what canidates are doing about those issues...They'd rather focus much more on whether that canidate is the same faith as them

You don't get it - people use that as a broad indicator of the person's character and what he'll do in office. I'm an agnostic, and I have a christian guy watch my house when I'm on frequent trips. Why? Because I know Christian ethics, and I know my house and all my stuff is safe with him.

and where they do their shopping...

Whaaaaaaatttttttt??????

Voters like you vote on fancy packaging, not what's in the box.

The apt description of an Obama voter. :D They're enchanted by a black guy who actually CAN conjugate the "to be" verb.

[AlicornsPrayer]

Probably much of the law has it's roots in religion - there is a law against murder because people think it's wrong. There are laws to help the poor because of the influence of charity requirements of the abrahamic religions. I don't like anti-religious bigots who think they can prescribe why people should vote this or that way.

I can see that I'm going to enjoy myself in regards to your responses...

The laws are no more based off of 'Abrahamic religions' then any other religion...The fact is, all religions/non-religions share the same values concerning murder, charity, or anything else...There's no need to put the sole focus/importance of such laws on Christian/Abrahamic ideologies at all.

I'm far from being anti-religion...I happen to find value in religion, as long as the individual is applying that religion to themselves only...Not using their religious beliefs to infrindge or take away the rights of others in preference of thier own ideologies...Period. Unfortunately, people are voting from the pulpit instead. And politicians are pandering to that ideology, by pitching their campaigns from the pulpit as welll, to garner those votes.


A vague statement - nobody could decipher it. What precisely does "place" mean?

LOL! That's it...let's do the 'nah, nah, nah...I don't know what you're talking about' game. Do I really have to explain it to you like you're a 3 year old? I have a higher opinon of you then you do of yourself it seems...

RELIGIOUS OPINION DOESN'T BELONG IN OUR GOVERMENT. Laws shouldn't reflect religious opinion, simply due to the diversity of religous practices in our country. Laws shouldn't reflect one favored religious viewpoint/practice over another.

Hence, seperation of church and state I support.

Is that simple enough for you...I'd draw you a picture, but unfortunatly I'm not so good with photoshop.



You don't get it - people use that as a broad indicator of the person's character and what he'll do in office. I'm an agnostic, and I have a christian guy watch my house when I'm on frequent trips. Why? Because I know Christian ethics, and I know my house and all my stuff is safe with him.

Good for you then...But are you saying that you and those that are non-Christian can't be trusted to prescribe to simple society rules? That in some way, the Christian is better capable of not murdering, robbing, or causing you/others harm because his ethics are better then yours or anyone else that isn't Christian?

Let me apologize to you now, cause I didn't realize that you thought so little of yourself and your personal ethics cause you're 'not a Christian'...No wonder you are inclined to focus on whether or not a canidate is/isn't Christian enough to you...Although I should thank you as well, for letting me know up front that you're an untrustworthy person cause of your beliefs...And that you're willing to lump anyone perceived/gossiped about not being a Christian into the same group as you view yourself...

Just...WOW!

I didn't realize (duh me) that a person's ethics are only valued by what their religion is, not by their actions towards others and for their communities in life...I usually determine a person's ethics by what they say and do...Thank you for opening up my eyes on this issue...


Whaaaaaaatttttttt??????

Why are you confused now? The shopping comment? Believe it or not, I've actually been on forums where voters actually discussed where the canidates shop, as a means to judge whether or not that politician was 'for the people'...Silly yes...But over the years, I've discovered alot of interesting reasons why people vote for particular canidates...Religion tops the list of reasons...But they also go by who makes the politicians' clothes, who cuts their hair (and how much it cost), to what grocery/retail stores those politicians frequent...

Heck, some go as far as to judge what restraunt a politician may have eaten/not eaten at...:confused:

Ask them though about what policies the canidate has voted on/appealed/created and they get the look of a deer caught in headlights.


The apt description of an Obama voter. :D They're enchanted by a black guy who actually CAN conjugate the "to be" verb.

I won't deny the fact out of all the canidates, Obama comes across as the most truthful. Mainly I'm impressed with his voting record, as well as bills he's worked on...Although I disagree with some of his personal opinions, the voting record he has shows that he isn't using his personal opinions, but what the people say they want, to vote/work on those bills and laws based on public demand.

Am I completely happy with him though? Would I vote for him as President?

No and no.

I personally don't think he's got the experience yet, to take up such a position. He's niave, as well as overly ideolistic. He talks a good talk (like all politicians) but he's not showing a specific direction in which to take this country to a better level.

I personally think he needs more time in the arena, so to speak. To grow into the responsibility of running our country. If he was Vice-Presidential nominee, then he'd probally get my vote...But that would also depend on who the Presidential nominee was that he would be running with.

So far, I don't see one canidate that is presidential material at this time in any of the camps. I'm tired of the same-old, same-old that the older politicians are spewing and the one canidate shouting change has no experience in making the change he's talking about.

So although I like Obama's work so far, I also can't support him in running for president because I don't feel he can fulfill that job at this time...There's others I feel that are more qualified and capable, that I'd love to see on the presidential ticket, but they aren't interested in running for that office...Yes, they're Christian...But their record and works for the public has been non-religious and has earned my trust of them. They just have no intrest in the executive office unfortunately.

From what I can see now with the choices of those actually running for president? I'll only be voting canidates into other offices, but the presidential portion of the ticket will remain blank.

[Libsmasher]

Exactly. We're electing a President, not a Pope.

So electing anyone with a religion is electing the pope.

Thank you for your :D "brilliant":D comment.

[Segep]

So electing anyone with a religion is electing the pope.

Thank you for your :D "brilliant":D comment.

Go ahead and laugh now. It won't be so funny when Coyote is President.

http://www.americanpoliticsforum.com/images/coyotepope.jpg

[Coyote]

hahaha! Thank you brother!

:D :D :D

[Coyote]

So electing anyone with a religion is electing the pope.

Thank you for your :D "brilliant":D comment.

Did I say that?


What's more important for a President?

Leadership qualifictions?

Religious qualifications?

I know what my answer is going to be.

[AlicornsPrayer]

Go ahead and laugh now. It won't be so funny when Coyote is President.



hahaha! Thank you brother!

:D :D :D


I'd probally vote for Coyote...I'd have to review her political work though. ;)

[Coyote]

I'd probally vote for Coyote...I'd have to review her political work though. ;)

Free roadkill for every American!!!!

[AlicornsPrayer]

Free roadkill for every American!!!!

Heck, in that case I can be your VP...Cause I can cook the roadkill for every American! I might even manage to get one of my relatives to make up some moonshine to go with that fried possume...

[Coyote]

Heck, in that case I can be your VP...Cause I can cook the roadkill for every American! I might even manage to get one of my relatives to make up some moonshine to go with that fried possume...

I think we've got the vote locked up;)

[crux]

It is curious how Eve chose to take instruction from them devil, instead of God.

It is the modern women that is being blinded by Obama's true self, for he is a tool of Satan himself.

So if you are a vile creature that wishes to spread immorality continue doing what you are now, you will answer for it in the end.

[Coyote]

Eve was screwed. But it's not her fault.

Lillith preceeded her and got jerked around for not being subservient enough.

Anyway, everyone knows snakes can't talk.

[vyo476]

Anyway, everyone knows snakes can't talk.

Next you'll be saying the Easter Bunny isn't real.

[AlicornsPrayer]

Eve was screwed. But it's not her fault.

Lillith preceeded her and got jerked around for not being subservient enough.

Anyway, everyone knows snakes can't talk.

I've always admired Lillith...If the serpent had approached her instead of Eve? Lillith would have eaten from the Tree of Life instead of the Tree of Knowlege first. :D Talk about a whole different history of mankind that would have resulted...LOL!

[AlicornsPrayer]

Next you'll be saying the Easter Bunny isn't real.

He isn't? Then who leaves me all that chocolate and colored eggs? Dang, next you'll be trying to convince me that Santa doesn't exsist...

[Libsmasher]

Did I say that?


What's more important for a President?

Leadership qualifictions?

Religious qualifications?



"Religious qualifications" preclude leadership qualifications?

Golllllleeeee gee - who'da thunk it! :p

And governor of massachusetts is a religious job?

[Libsmasher]

Eve was screwed. But it's not her fault.


Eve was the first in a very long line of women to screw up a man's life.

[heyjude]

Adam was the first man to blame his failures on a woman. They've been doing it every since.

[Izz]

*raises hand* I know I personally am to blame for every abortion, every failed attempt at peace in the middle east, and the extensive destruction of Chernobyl.

they don't give you boobs for nothing.