Does a candidate for president need to show their birth certificate?

[NO Obamanation]

Does a candidate for president need to show their birth certificate?



Actually can someone be a state senator or a US senator if they have never shown a birth certificate?

I heard a lot today in the news that Obama has never shown his birth certificate. I tried to find out if it was true or not, from what I can find, it is true that he has never shown it. But is that legal? and why on earth would he refuse to show it?





http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZTgxZmIwNTg0OWVhMWJkODNmZjI4ZjY4Mjg2OWRmNzI=

[Popeye]

Does a candidate for president need to show their birth certificate?



Actually can someone be a state senator or a US senator if they have never shown a birth certificate?

I heard a lot today in the news that Obama has never shown his birth certificate. I tried to find out if it was true or not, from what I can find, it is true that he has never shown it. But is that legal? and why on earth would he refuse to show it?





http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZTgxZmIwNTg0OWVhMWJkODNmZjI4ZjY4Mjg2OWRmNzI=

He has traveled abroad, to get a passport he would have had to show it then. Maybe he just wants to get all of you worked up over nothing, like with the whitey tape.

[NO Obamanation]

He has traveled abroad, to get a passport he would have had to show it then. Maybe he just wants to get all of you worked up over nothing, like with the whitey tape.

Is there a law though that he has to show it? Can he keep saying no till after November?

[pocketfullofshells]

I am guessing that you needed to prove you where able to be President when you filed the papers. Birth Certificate is not the only way to prove it.

[NO Obamanation]

I am guessing that you needed to prove you where able to be President when you filed the papers. Birth Certificate is not the only way to prove it.

I still want to see it. It should be my right as a voter. I think that is really wierd if we cant see it. I just took for granted that people have, now that I know people have not. I want it done.

[NO Obamanation]

Still trying to find a birth certificate, still no luck but in the process I found a very interesting news article about his duel citizenship with Kenya.


http://www.politicalgateway.com/main/columns/read.html?col=731

[pocketfullofshells]

I still want to see it. It should be my right as a voter. I think that is really weird if we cant see it. I just took for granted that people have, now that I know people have not. I want it done.

Have you seen McCain was porn in the Panama Canal Zone, maybe he was not really born in Panama or something...Have you seen his? More Senseless Smear by the Right , I am starting to just say Screw McCain even if I like him personally, because I hate the retards on the Right who pull this crap so much I hate to see them get anything. The More I have to Defend against these dumb Lies and hidden Racial Jabs , makes me just Like Obama more and more.

[NO Obamanation]

Have you seen McCain was porn in the Panama Canal Zone, maybe he was not really born in Panama or something...Have you seen his? More Senseless Smear by the Right , I am starting to just say Screw McCain even if I like him personally, because I hate the retards on the Right who pull this crap so much I hate to see them get anything. The More I have to Defend against these dumb Lies and hidden Racial Jabs , makes me just Like Obama more and more.


LOL don’t vote for McCain, I don’t care. I don’t think I am voting for McCain.

He may have done porn in panama for all I know and I don’t care about that either. :D

Apparently Obama being asked but not showing his birth certificate has been the talk for a while but I just heard about it. I am interested in knowing that someone has seen his birth certificate. I would assume someone has seen McCain’s, or I would have read that while reading about Obama not showing his.

If you think I am trying to get you to vote for McCain, by asking if anyone knows of any article saying someone in some sort of authority has seen Obama's birth certificate, I am sorry but I am not. I wish no one would vote for McCain and no one would vote for Obama and we had to find two actually decent candidates before we went any further.

[GenSeneca]

Have you seen McCain...Have you seen his?--pocketfullofshells

Someone has, its been in the media and I think thats Nobama's point... I don't think he personally needs to see Obama's Birth Certificate, just to know that someone impartial has, that it does exist and Obama is an American citizen.

I don't see it as a racial jab either... People went after McCains place of Birth in hopes of disqualifying him as a candidate for president. (Democrats would like nothing better than to run unopposed in the National Election)

Well that cuts both ways. They went after McCain to find out out if he was technically born in the US, seems pretty fair to hold Obama to the same scrutiny and standard.
-----------------------------
Imagine the CHAOS if Obama were elected - then was found NOT to be a US citizen - and forced from office. He'd make history twice!

[NO Obamanation]

Well it does turn out that McCain also refuses to release his birth certificate, but he did let a reporter look at it. I would like it if he let more than one reporter look at it and he may have but this reporter told what they personally saw.

below cut from link:

As I reported earlier, the McCain campaign has declined to publicly release the senator's birth certificate. But a senior campaign official showed me a copy of his birth certificate issued by the "family hospital" in the Coco Solo submarine base. (McCain's grandfather commanded the Coco Solo Naval Air Station in 1936; his father was the executive officer of a submarine based in Coco Solo.)

The birth certificate was signed by Captain W. L. Irvine. I have now checked that name against the Naval Register for 1936, and I find that William Lorne Irvine was director of the medical facility at the submarine base hospital in Coco Solo, Panama Canal Zone, during that time period. You can see the entry here. I think this effectively disposes of any remaining doubts that McCain was born inside the Canal Zone.

Full story

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/05/john_mccains_birthplace.html

[NO Obamanation]

On another note that is bothering me.



I think people are getting the wrong idea of what we are doing here. Or maybe I have the wrong idea.

I do not come here to read the various posts thinking my opinion is going to be swayed and I will end up supporting someone or some idea that I did not before. I did not think anyone else came here for that either.

And I certainly do not think, in fact I HOPE that nothing I say changes anyone else. That is not why I am here.

I am here to exchange thoughts, debate a bit, and rant a bit. Not everyone in the world likes politics and some only like to talk with others who have a like minded mindset.

I would think everyone that comes here does it for the same reasons as me, they love to talk about politics, they like to argue and debate and everyone in their home life wishes they would stop talking about it. So this is a nice place to come talk, everyone else likes the same topic.

I have no intent to change anyone’s mind or sway their thinking. I would rather talk with people who completely disagree with me and find out why. Not so I can change them or so they can change me, just because it’s interesting to see other peoples thought processes.

So, with that in mind, I hope everyone is clear my posts are not to change your thinking, they are just to release my pent up political frustrations and appease my love for arguments.

[Bunz]

I find this kind of interesting. I couldnt log on yesterday, but heard about this on the news. I am a bit confused on the motivation. Is there a school of thought in some circles that thinks an Obama birth certificate will somehow disqualify him from being President? Not born in America(oh wait that was McCain) or is possibly not old enough?
In the name of transparency he should release it if he still has one(mine is long gone).
But...
If Cindy McCain continues to refuse to release her tax returns, I see no reason why Obama not releasing his BC is an issue. I think Americans have a right to know where the first lady's money comes from and what she is invested in.

[Andy]

Have you seen McCain was porn in the Panama Canal Zone, maybe he was not really born in Panama or something...Have you seen his? More Senseless Smear by the Right , I am starting to just say Screw McCain even if I like him personally, because I hate the retards on the Right who pull this crap so much I hate to see them get anything. The More I have to Defend against these dumb Lies and hidden Racial Jabs , makes me just Like Obama more and more.

This always amuses me. Ok, so a candidate running for president of the entire nation, refuses to show his birth certificate despite a law requiring that you be a US born citizen. What exactly are the 'people on the right' making up?

[Andy]

I find this kind of interesting. I couldnt log on yesterday, but heard about this on the news. I am a bit confused on the motivation. Is there a school of thought in some circles that thinks an Obama birth certificate will somehow disqualify him from being President? Not born in America(oh wait that was McCain) or is possibly not old enough?
In the name of transparency he should release it if he still has one(mine is long gone).
But...
If Cindy McCain continues to refuse to release her tax returns, I see no reason why Obama not releasing his BC is an issue. I think Americans have a right to know where the first lady's money comes from and what she is invested in.

This is another unbelievable position. Cindy isn't running for office, yet I still would expect her to release her tax returns. However... this idea that 'well if someone else is doing X, then it's ok for this person to do Y' is a laughable joke!

They are both wrong positions! Two wrong actions doesn't suddenly make them right! It's no wonder we have such lame people running for office when all they have to do is find some ding bat somewhere doing something, and everyone just gives them a pass on what they do!

We excuse everyone in the name of everyone being excused and then complain about corruption in politics. Time for Americans to grow up a bit. Because someone else did it, doesn't make it right.

[PLC1]

He has traveled abroad, to get a passport he would have had to show it then. Maybe he just wants to get all of you worked up over nothing, like with the whitey tape.

His candidacy has been very successful at getting people worked up over nothing, as has that of McCain.

Cut to the chase!

What are the real issues, you know, the issues over which the president actually has some influence?

What are the candidates' differences of opinion on those issues?

Are the candidates capable of carrying out their agenda?

Those are the questions we should be asking ourselves, not about lapel pins, or birth certificates.

[NO Obamanation]

I find this kind of interesting. I couldnt log on yesterday, but heard about this on the news. I am a bit confused on the motivation. Is there a school of thought in some circles that thinks an Obama birth certificate will somehow disqualify him from being President? Not born in America(oh wait that was McCain) or is possibly not old enough?
In the name of transparency he should release it if he still has one(mine is long gone).
But...
If Cindy McCain continues to refuse to release her tax returns, I see no reason why Obama not releasing his BC is an issue. I think Americans have a right to know where the first lady's money comes from and what she is invested in.



I think if you are running for president of the United States you should show it. McCain should too. I am mixed with my feelings about spouse’s privacy, it’s probably a good idea for there to be no privacy I guess but that seems so un-American :( I disagree that a candidate for president can say if the other candidate’s wife does not do A B or C I don’t have to do X Y or Z

They should at least have to show their birth certificate! Maybe there is nothing wrong at all with his birth certificate but it should be just a formality if nothing else.

Apparently he was asked by reporters months ago and was told no months ago, I am a bit surprised that I am just hearing about it. And I am (as usual) spittin mad that he wont show it.

[NO Obamanation]

This is another unbelievable position. Cindy isn't running for office, yet I still would expect her to release her tax returns. However... this idea that 'well if someone else is doing X, then it's ok for this person to do Y' is a laughable joke!

They are both wrong positions! Two wrong actions doesn't suddenly make them right! It's no wonder we have such lame people running for office when all they have to do is find some ding bat somewhere doing something, and everyone just gives them a pass on what they do!

We excuse everyone in the name of everyone being excused and then complain about corruption in politics. Time for Americans to grow up a bit. Because someone else did it, doesn't make it right.

:o I should have read your post before I replied to Bunz, we both used the Y X and Z

:o

[NO Obamanation]

His candidacy has been very successful at getting people worked up over nothing, as has that of McCain.

Cut to the chase!

What are the real issues, you know, the issues over which the president actually has some influence?

What are the candidates' differences of opinion on those issues?

Are the candidates capable of carrying out their agenda?

Those are the questions we should be asking ourselves, not about lapel pins, or birth certificates.
Sorry but I have to disagree with you about the birth certificate. I am just stunned that anyone would defend his not showing this. It probably is a perfectly fine document legal and all on the up and up. But just for formality sake if the job you are applying for has certain restrictions, like being born in a certain place or being a certain age, if for nothing else the document should be shown.

How hard would it be to show it? A big issue is being made about it but only because he isn’t showing it. An issue easily avoided.

[pocketfullofshells]

This always amuses me. Ok, so a candidate running for president of the entire nation, refuses to show his birth certificate despite a law requiring that you be a US born citizen. What exactly are the 'people on the right' making up?

The reason for this whole issues is morons starting the rumor he was Born in Kenya...You know to add to his Secret Muslim ....and my new Fav..his real middle name is Mohammad not Hussein ( yes because we know that's a much better middle name )

And as for someone saying McCain shows some reporter it, who cares? I can show a untrained person one saying I am 38, from Florida, and my name is Juan. not that hard to fake. Personaly I have never seen mine, not even sure I have one to see.

But there is no reason to belive he is not a American Citizen who can run for office. Its more games buy hacks on the Right.

at least if they tried to McCain him with Black babies, will not work so well this time....

[pocketfullofshells]

This is another unbelievable position. Cindy isn't running for office, yet I still would expect her to release her tax returns. However... this idea that 'well if someone else is doing X, then it's ok for this person to do Y' is a laughable joke!

They are both wrong positions! Two wrong actions doesn't suddenly make them right! It's no wonder we have such lame people running for office when all they have to do is find some ding bat somewhere doing something, and everyone just gives them a pass on what they do!

We excuse everyone in the name of everyone being excused and then complain about corruption in politics. Time for Americans to grow up a bit. Because someone else did it, doesn't make it right.

Its basically to make sure that someone does not just give the money to the wife to hide the funds...But I am fairly sure she has actually put her tax records out now anyway so its not a issue. Not that I cared in the first place

[pocketfullofshells]

I think if you are running for president of the United States you should show it. McCain should too. I am mixed with my feelings about spouse’s privacy, it’s probably a good idea for there to be no privacy I guess but that seems so un-American :( I disagree that a candidate for president can say if the other candidate’s wife does not do A B or C I don’t have to do X Y or Z

They should at least have to show their birth certificate! Maybe there is nothing wrong at all with his birth certificate but it should be just a formality if nothing else.

Apparently he was asked by reporters months ago and was told no months ago, I am a bit surprised that I am just hearing about it. And I am (as usual) spittin mad that he wont show it.

And when he does, you will find something else no doubt....And again, I think in order to run you have to have already proved you can be president when you filed the papers for all legal proof needed. Its not like they check at the door, hey wait are you legal to be President?

[GenSeneca]

who cares?

I once worked a job doing security for 8 bucks an hour and I was required to have a full federal background check - which included the original, or notarized copy of my, Birth Certificate. I don't care who's running for president, they will have the highest level of security clearance in the country and should be properly vetted. Their jobs gonna be worth a lot more than 8 Bucks an hour, its not asking "too much" but a Drug Test might be...

Come to think of it, I had to take a drug test as well... I don't know of ANY politicians being subject to Drug Tests, am I wrong? Perhaps thats where we should start, demanding the same standards for public office that we adhere to out in the actual Public.

BTW, anyone know what brand of Cigarettes Obama smokes??

[NO Obamanation]

I once worked a job doing security for 8 bucks an hour and I was required to have a full federal background check - which included the original, or notarized copy of my, Birth Certificate. I don't care who's running for president, they will have the highest level of security clearance in the country and should be properly vetted. Their jobs gonna be worth a lot more than 8 Bucks an hour, its not asking "too much" but a Drug Test might be...

Come to think of it, I had to take a drug test as well... I don't know of ANY politicians being subject to Drug Tests, am I wrong? Perhaps thats where we should start, demanding the same standards for public office that we adhere to out in the actual Public.

BTW, anyone know what brand of Cigarettes Obama smokes??


The only time I ever had to show my birth certificate was when I got my first ID card. My state no longer requires proof of citizenship to get a drivers license, and apparently we can’t fly on planes after this year because our license is not valid.

I did not even have to show it when I applied to foster other peoples children, I did not even have to provide it when I adopted.

Some one wrote in this post they would have to fill out forms to apply for the job of president. What forms? Where are they? And wouldn’t they be public access? If he ever showed his birth certificate for those forms or any other forms no one would be asking to see it. If everything is A OK then why refuse to show it. If he were running for any other job I wouldn’t think he should “have” to show it, but this job yes he should.

I just assumed that everyone did. If any other person was able to run for president without showing it, I wouldn’t like that either.

He said he quit smoking but I would guess Marlboro?

[PLC1]

I heard he was on the patch.

If he succeeds in stopping smoking, it will prove he has more willpower than probably 90% of the public, at least the public that is addicted to nicotine.

Now for the real shocker:

The reason Obama doesn't want to show his birth certificate is that he was never born.:eek:

It's true. He was cloned in a secret labratory by mad scientists bent on taking over the world.

Pass it on. Everyone must know.

[GenSeneca]

He was cloned in a secret labratory by mad scientists bent on taking over the world.

I heard about that too... its all been an elaborate scheme by the vast Right Wing Conspiracy to thwart Bill and Hillary from returning to the White House.

Obama is going to pick a Military guy for his VP, the RWC is going to have Obama removed from office after the election and control the country through their Military puppet-head.

Tehee..:D

[NO Obamanation]

I do not think it was the right wing conspiracy that started the talk on his birth certificate. From what I have read it was astrologers. They wanted the exact time and date to do an astrological chart for him and he refused to show it, probably those nasty republicans took it from there.

[NO Obamanation]

New news about Obama's birth certificate. Nothing his followers will like.

It seems it was made with photoshop. I know I know, what does it matter if he has never shown any one his birth certificate. It matters to me. and when he finally did show it under pressure, online only so no one could actually look at the seal, it seems its not the real deal.

there are more links out there than the ones I posted but its midnight and I figure if someone wanted more they can look for more. :)



http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/07/atlas-tech-expe.html


http://mediamatters.org/items/200808150001

[Bunz]

New news about Obama's birth certificate. Nothing his followers will like.

It seems it was made with photoshop. I know I know, what does it matter if he has never shown any one his birth certificate. It matters to me. and when he finally did show it under pressure, online only so no one could actually look at the seal, it seems its not the real deal.
Well wait a minute here, the first story you posted said it was genuine. The State of Hawaii. This is from your source.
On the August 15 edition of Fox News' Fox & Friends, Jerome Corsi, author of The Obama Nation: Leftist Politics and the Cult of Personality, claimed that the campaign of Sen. Barack Obama "has a false, fake birth certificate posted on their website." In fact, the Hawaii Department of Health has confirmed that the birth certificate posted online by the Obama campaign is "a valid Hawaii state birth certificate" and has called the speculation about Obama's citizenship "pretty ridiculous."

[top gun]

Does a candidate for president need to show their birth certificate?

Actually can someone be a state senator or a US senator if they have never shown a birth certificate?

I heard a lot today in the news that Obama has never shown his birth certificate. I tried to find out if it was true or not, from what I can find, it is true that he has never shown it. But is that legal? and why on earth would he refuse to show it?

http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZTgxZmIwNTg0OWVhMWJkODNmZjI4ZjY4Mjg2OWRmNzI=


Actually if you want to get technical Senator Obama was born in Hawaii one of our great Untied States! It's John McSame that was not born in American.

McSame was actually born in Panama. The only reason he can run is because it was at a US military base in Panama.

[NO Obamanation]

Actually if you want to get technical Senator Obama was born in Hawaii one of our great Untied States! It's John McSame that was not born in American.

McSame was actually born in Panama. The only reason he can run is because it was at a US military base in Panama.

Actually you are right, and the wierd thing is if he had been born a few months earlier or something he would not be qualified because that area was in other than us control or something strange.

[Sihouette]

I once worked a job doing security for 8 bucks an hour and I was required to have a full federal background check - which included the original, or notarized copy of my, Birth Certificate. I don't care who's running for president, they will have the highest level of security clearance in the country and should be properly vetted. Their jobs gonna be worth a lot more than 8 Bucks an hour, its not asking "too much" but a Drug Test might be.
~ Genseneca

My daughter works counting money for a casino. You would not BELIEVE the hoops they made her jump through. And their budget and security issues are infintessimally minute compared to our nation's highest office.

She had drug tests, background checks, birth certificate scrutiny, fingerprinting. Regular random resubmittal to drug tests. And they even did background checks on members of her family and friend circles. They followed every one of her references, calling every one up. And four months later they called all of them up again to make sure they weren't "faked" by friends and whatnot..to catch them off guard.

Her "team" isn't allowed to talk to other members of the casino and are cloistered in a tiny windowless room for up to 12 hours per day, have their own special break area and must leave the casino immediately after their shift is over and not speak to other employees or patrons as they make their way to their cars.

And we don't even have Obama's real, authentic birth certificate?

If I tried to run for office of President, I guarantee I'd have to show mine.

Just another drop in the titanic reservoir of "Obama doesn't have to cuz he's black and you'll be racist if insist he be vetted."

I for one am done with this stonewalling and insist, along with Obamanation, that a thorough background check be done on this clown.

[NO Obamanation]

Well wait a minute here, the first story you posted said it was genuine. The State of Hawaii. This is from your source.

There are other reports that the Hawaii did not look at it. So it depends on what report you are reading. Either way why would anyone’s birth certificate have Photoshop water marks?

One of the reports from Hawaii said if it was faked he would have had to fool everyone from grade school to the government when running for senator. But they are not taking into account none of these places said they had a copy of his birth certificate, the only known copy is with Hawaii and they refuse to let anyone see it, and on the Obama website and it has photo shop watermarks.

This won’t matter to you or to most people who are Obama followers; this is just something that bothers me. And until I get a good explanation to why, it will continue to bother me.

[Sihouette]

Ditto.

[pocketfullofshells]

and if he waved it around for all..you would just find some other reason anyway so who cares? Its clear that no matter what you 2 would not vote for him, so why should he have to jump threw hopes to appease people like you? No non ranting aboma hater is actuly going around thinking he may not be a US Citizen...just not no rational person realy thinks McCain is not . If they do they they would never vote for that person anyway.

And for all the talk about how lax the looking over things are....Any of you actuly know what you have to do to file? and Get on the ballot and all that legaly? or you just guessing?

Also Here is what you need to run for President...US Citizen...35 years old or more...thats about it...there is nothing in teh contiution that says more then that. Working for a company is not the same.

[NO Obamanation]

and if he waved it around for all..you would just find some other reason anyway so who cares? Its clear that no matter what you 2 would not vote for him, so why should he have to jump threw hopes to appease people like you? No non ranting aboma hater is actuly going around thinking he may not be a US Citizen...just not no rational person realy thinks McCain is not . If they do they they would never vote for that person anyway.

And for all the talk about how lax the looking over things are....Any of you actuly know what you have to do to file? and Get on the ballot and all that legaly? or you just guessing?

Also Here is what you need to run for President...US Citizen...35 years old or more...thats about it...there is nothing in teh contiution that says more then that. Working for a company is not the same.


I am pretty darn sure I am not the only one wondering why the only known birth certificate has photshop watermarks.

for me it is about more than the Sinclair story, the birth certificate.

but for some its just those things, and they might like him if not for those questions.

As an American citizen, I think I have the right to ask such questions and I will. I am so glad that I can and will not blindly support someone.

[top gun]

I am pretty darn sure I am not the only one wondering why the only known birth certificate has photshop watermarks.




NOPE! You're the only one...:)

and I think you mean "photoshop" marks...:)

But seriously do ya think maybe... just maybe... someone who's been in several contested political campaigns... is a United States Senator who has to have CLEARANCE to review important documents to do his job... goes overseas regularly with what one would have to assume is a valid US Passport to which a valid Birth Certificate is required to get...

might... just maybe have a valid birth certificate?

Take a while before you respond. Think it over. Talk to a few people outside of say Middle School. Call your local BMV or Post Office on regulations to get a Passport.

You're a good person... you certainly don't want to look stupid.

[NO Obamanation]

NOPE! You're the only one...:)

and I think you mean "photoshop" marks...:)

But seriously do ya think maybe... just maybe... someone who's been in several contested political campaigns... is a United States Senator who has to have CLEARANCE to review important documents to do his job... goes overseas regularly with what one would have to assume is a valid US Passport to which a valid Birth Certificate is required to get...

might... just maybe have a valid birth certificate?

Take a while before you respond. Think it over. Talk to a few people outside of say Middle School. Call your local BMV or Post Office on regulations to get a Passport.

You're a good person... you certainly don't want to look stupid.



Thank you for the spelling correction, I usually do try to check all that but I don't always.

I do not think this one is real, I did not when he first posted it and I still do not.

You do not show a copy of your birth certificate to get a job in government, People have already asked in Ill. There was no record of it on file. The only two places I know of that has a copy is Hawaii and his website, the problem is the one in his website has Photoshop watermarks and that is to strange, and the one in Hawaii, they refuse to show us

John McCain had a similar problem in 2000; he showed his then when there were questions about when and where he was born. The doctor who witnessed the live birth and signed his certificate was looked into (I saw no signature on Obama's) I have a signature on mine... Any one else would just give the certificate up to be looked at instead of posting one online with Photoshop water marks, only the "One" we have been waiting for seems to have different standards.

[pocketfullofshells]

NOPE! You're the only one...:)

and I think you mean "photoshop" marks...:)

But seriously do ya think maybe... just maybe... someone who's been in several contested political campaigns... is a United States Senator who has to have CLEARANCE to review important documents to do his job... goes overseas regularly with what one would have to assume is a valid US Passport to which a valid Birth Certificate is required to get...

might... just maybe have a valid birth certificate?

Take a while before you respond. Think it over. Talk to a few people outside of say Middle School. Call your local BMV or Post Office on regulations to get a Passport.


You're a good person... you certainly don't want to look stupid.


Come on, you know they let anyone on those committees and to handle info on lose nukes....

and photoshop...maybe cuz when they scaned it they used photoshop? you think they are so dumb will all that money they would make a fake and then print photoshop on it? got to think more here ....

[NO Obamanation]

and photoshop...maybe cuz when they scaned it they used photoshop? you think they are so dumb will all that money they would make a fake and then print photoshop on it? got to think more here ....

I do not know much about Photoshop, that is possible, so why not just clear it up?

[Sihouette]

The forensic study done on the photoshopped birth certificate shows a modification to the, I think serial number, done in June of this year...pretty sure that's when he was being pressed to produce it..

Apparently these programs leave a signature of modification that mega-geeks can sleuth out the exact pixels, time and date of modification?

According to that link I provided.

[NO Obamanation]

The forensic study done on the photoshopped birth certificate shows a modification to the, I think serial number, done in June of this year...pretty sure that's when he was being pressed to produce it..

Apparently these programs leave a signature of modification that mega-geeks can sleuth out the exact pixels, time and date of modification?

According to that link I provided.

why should he modify anything though, who is hurt if he just hands it over to be looked at or if he doesnt want any ones dirty fingers on it, just make a call to the Hawaii department of what ever and say release your copy for reporters.

was the serial number 666 or something ?

[Sihouette]

Maybe they didn't want the actual number traced for fear of having modifications discovered to an actual document?

That would be my first guess: send people on a wild goose chase until they get tired of asking and move on to rivet their inquiries on lesser things..

[NO Obamanation]

Maybe they didn't want the actual number traced for fear of having modifications discovered to an actual document?

That would be my first guess: send people on a wild goose chase until they get tired of asking and move on to rivet their inquiries on lesser things..

Well I admit I am getting tired of it. My God just answer the questions at hand, produce the documents needed and then we can move on.

I am really starting to hope the man can worm his way into the White House just so I can start my patrotic Disent!

[top gun]

Thank you for the spelling correction, I usually do try to check all that but I don't always.

I do not think this one is real, I did not when he first posted it and I still do not.

You do not show a copy of your birth certificate to get a job in government, People have already asked in Ill. There was no record of it on file. The only two places I know of that has a copy is Hawaii and his website, the problem is the one in his website has Photoshop watermarks and that is to strange, and the one in Hawaii, they refuse to show us

John McCain had a similar problem in 2000; he showed his then when there were questions about when and where he was born. The doctor who witnessed the live birth and signed his certificate was looked into (I saw no signature on Obama's) I have a signature on mine... Any one else would just give the certificate up to be looked at instead of posting one online with Photoshop water marks, only the "One" we have been waiting for seems to have different standards.

Do ya even have a Passport? Just askin'?

I do... use it a couple times a year.

You have to send in your original (also called a certified copy) to get one. No photo copies... you might be surprised to know that the government actually figured out smugglers and such might send in a fraud if they accepted photo copies and not originals.

You'd be surprised... they're always sittin' around just thinkin' about stuff like that.:confused:

So go to bed tonight secure in the knowledge that if United States Senator Barack Obama has a Passport... he has a valid birth certificate.

[top gun]

Come on, you know they let anyone on those committees and to handle info on lose nukes....

and photoshop...maybe cuz when they scaned it they used photoshop? you think they are so dumb will all that money they would make a fake and then print photoshop on it? got to think more here ....


YA THINK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

Heck if I knew people really thought photoshop was all that good I'd have been printing my own cash years ago! I wonder where these people work... because I may need to make a purchase!;)

[NO Obamanation]

Do ya even have a Passport? Just askin'?

I do... use it a couple times a year.

You have to send in your original (also called a certified copy) to get one. No photo copies... you might be surprised to know that the government actually figured out smugglers and such might send in a fraud if they accepted photo copies and not originals.

You'd be surprised... they're always sittin' around just thinkin' about stuff like that.:confused:

So go to bed tonight secure in the knowledge that if United States Senator Barack Obama has a Passport... he has a valid birth certificate.


Well I am not secure in the knowledge that he has one since he wont let anyone see anything except for an online copy that has photoshop watermarks, but I am sure I will find a way to muster sleep tonight.

I will have sweet dreams of dissent and how I will call him Hitler for the next four years and complain he cares more about other countries than he does his own, and how he is raping the American people via taxes and socializing the nation to be like Europe. I hope he picks John Kerry for a VP so I can double dissent :)

[top gun]

Well I am not secure in the knowledge that he has one since he wont let anyone see anything except for an online copy that has photoshop watermarks, but I am sure I will find a way to muster sleep tonight.

I will have sweet dreams of dissent and how I will call him Hitler for the next four years and complain he cares more about other countries than he does his own, and how he is raping the American people via taxes and socializing the nation to be like Europe. I hope he picks John Kerry for a VP so I can double dissent :)

So basically what you're trying to say is you're clueless when it comes to the procedures & documents required to get a US Passport.

Very well, glad we cleared that up............. dissent on.;)

[NO Obamanation]

So basically what you're trying to say is you're clueless when it comes to the procedures & documents required to get a US Passport.

Very well, glad we cleared that up............. dissent on.;)

I know the standards for passports are higher now than they were before but I dont know that you send your actual birth certificate for proof. Obama might have a hard time with that one.


ok dissent on....


Obama is a terrorist, he is Hitlers twin, he is.,,,,,, (trying to think of the other silly things said about bush)

oh yes

Obama is a MORON and that I really mean :)

Obama is a mack daddy what ever the heck that is, Pastor mannings said he was!

and he is a crack addict who cheats on his wife!


ahh I see why you all have been doing this
i really do feel better now :)

[top gun]

I know the standards for passports are higher now than they were before but I dont know that you send your actual birth certificate for proof. Obama might have a hard time with that one.


ok dissent on....


Obama is a terrorist, he is Hitlers twin, he is.,,,,,, (trying to think of the other silly things said about bush)

oh yes

Obama is a MORON and that I really mean :)

Obama is a mack daddy what ever the heck that is, Pastor mannings said he was!

and he is a crack addict who cheats on his wife!


ahh I see why you all have been doing this
i really do feel better now :)


Nope again... You must not get out much... you've always needed an original (certified) copy of your birth certificate to attain a US Passport. In fact that's kinda a scary thing about getting a Passport... you start thinking...that's my original birth certificate, what if it gets lost in the mail! But that's the only thing they'll accept so if you want a US Passport you do it!

On all that babble & nonsense... that's exactly why you guys will lose. It's all name calling, completely fictional smears & baby talk...

It will be good for you to have a rational President Obama & his family in the White House.;)

[NO Obamanation]

Nope again... You must not get out much... you've always needed an original (certified) copy of your birth certificate to attain a US Passport. In fact that's kinda a scary thing about getting a Passport... you start thinking...that's my original birth certificate, what if it gets lost in the mail! But that's the only thing they'll accept so if you want a US Passport you do it!

On all that babble & nonsense... that's exactly why you guys will lose. It's all name calling, completely fictional smears & baby talk...

It will be good for you to have a rational President Obama & his family in the White House.;)

OH Top!

I wont start my dissent till after he is elected. Then it will be all out war. I wll break my promise I have always made. I didnt get on the hate clinton band wagon, I discouraged it, but this time I will promote it, but only if he wins. and I will remind every lib in my area and there are lots and lots of them that this is the highest form of patriotims, you taught me that :)
and watch them flip me off

ugh i hope i dont get fired for it :)

[NO Obamanation]

Nope again... You must not get out much... you've always needed an original (certified) copy of your birth certificate to attain a US Passport. In fact that's kinda a scary thing about getting a Passport... you start thinking...that's my original birth certificate, what if it gets lost in the mail! But that's the only thing they'll accept so if you want a US Passport you do it!

On all that babble & nonsense... that's exactly why you guys will lose. It's all name calling, completely fictional smears & baby talk...

It will be good for you to have a rational President Obama & his family in the White House.;)

You are right i dont go to other Countries much, I have been to canada (hated it) and i went to mexico (loved it)

but I have not been anyplace else. I think I should see more of my own country before I go seeing other countries.

I am going to check into the passport thing, I dont know that I believe you :)

[BigRob]

You are right i dont go to other Countries much, I have been to canada (hated it) and i went to mexico (loved it)

but I have not been anyplace else. I think I should see more of my own country before I go seeing other countries.

I am going to check into the passport thing, I dont know that I believe you :)

You are required to show "proof of citizenship." This is commonly a birth certificate, but it does not always have to be, as some people are citizens but were not born here.

[NO Obamanation]

You are required to show "proof of citizenship." This is commonly a birth certificate, but it does not always have to be, as some people are citizens but were not born here.

Thank you Rob :)


TOP GUN DID YOU READ THAT???



So I still say its odd that no one has ever seen his birth certificate and he refuses to give it up for us to see except for a online copy that has photoshop watermarks :)

[pocketfullofshells]

You are right i dont go to other Countries much, I have been to canada (hated it) and i went to mexico (loved it)

but I have not been anyplace else. I think I should see more of my own country before I go seeing other countries.

I am going to check into the passport thing, I dont know that I believe you :)

I had to have my Orig as well for my Passport when I went to Ireland...

[NO Obamanation]

I had to have my Orig as well for my Passport when I went to Ireland...

what year did you go to Ireland?

that is one country I really really really would love to see.

[pocketfullofshells]

what year did you go to Ireland?

that is one country I really really really would love to see.

2004? I think its soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo great. I just wish I made it to Belfast, but most of the people where happy to skip it...things where not settled there at the time, alot of fighting.

[NO Obamanation]

2004? I think its soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo great. I just wish I made it to Belfast, but most of the people where happy to skip it...things where not settled there at the time, alot of fighting.

Are you Irish? Your logo picture is Irish :)


Well after 911 I know they got really strict on passport stuff, I wonder did you get your passport that year or had you had it since before 2001?

If your passport was given in the 90s or before and just renewed it might be more like Big Rob was saying. Though that would not fly today I am sure, unless you were not born here.

[top gun]

You are right i dont go to other Countries much, I have been to canada (hated it) and i went to mexico (loved it)

but I have not been anyplace else. I think I should see more of my own country before I go seeing other countries.

I am going to check into the passport thing, I dont know that I believe you :)

Well take my word if you want to go to Canada or Mexico again you'll need to do that. I'd hate to see ya standing there stranded at the border.:)

[pocketfullofshells]

Are you Irish? Your logo picture is Irish :)


Well after 911 I know they got really strict on passport stuff, I wonder did you get your passport that year or had you had it since before 2001?

If your passport was given in the 90s or before and just renewed it might be more like Big Rob was saying. Though that would not fly today I am sure, unless you were not born here.

it was after 911, when we stoped in Shanon airport in ireland before Dublin, they had US Custums agents walk threw checking with dogs for Bombs and evrything ( in case someone left something on the plane ..And that was the only time I ever was overseas

[NO Obamanation]

Well take my word if you want to go to Canada or Mexico again you'll need to do that. I'd hate to see ya standing there stranded at the border.:)


I agree that today you must show it, ever since 911 things have been far more strict, but it’s like my drivers license…


I got my ID at 16, all I had to do to get it was show an envelope sent through the mail addressed to me and a work permit that I obtained without any ID.

I used that ID later to get my drivers license and I continue to renew it to this day by just showing my older one.

Any one who has a passport that is just renewing only need to show the current passport, if their mother got their passport when they were ten while traveling to Indonesia the standards for obtaining then are not what they are today.

[NO Obamanation]

it was after 911, when we stoped in Shanon airport in ireland before Dublin, they had US Custums agents walk threw checking with dogs for Bombs and evrything ( in case someone left something on the plane ..And that was the only time I ever was overseas

I am really glad for you that you were able to go. Have you ever read a book called the history of the Irish Race?

[BigRob]

I am really glad for you that you were able to go. Have you ever read a book called the history of the Irish Race?

You should definitely go if you ever get the chance. I would also recommend going to Scotland when you are over there.

[NO Obamanation]

An update on the Obama birth certificate issue. NOPE, I am not going to forget about it 

For anyone interested in taking the time there is a great deal of information in the posted website along with the information about the law suit.

I forget who brought up Obama having a passport and how he would have to show a birth certificate...

Something I had not thought of and found out through this attorney. Obama used an Indonesian passport when traveling to Pakistan for his foreign policy experience in college. What is an American doing with an Indonesian passport anyway?



Story below

(Lafayette Hill, Pennsylvania – 09/04/08) - Philip J. Berg, Esquire, the Attorney who filed suit against Barack H. Obama challenging Senator Obama’s eligibility to serve as President of the United States, has received confirmation from his Process Service Company that the Democratic National Committee (DNC) and Senator Barack Obama were served today, September 4, 2008, with the legal documents pertaining to Berg vs. Obama, Civil Action No. 08-cv-4083.



http://www.obamacrimes.com/

[Dawkinsrocks]

Its a shame that the Bush administration, knowing that an airline could be used by terrorists as a missile didn't deploy better security before 9/11.

And that nobody was disciplined for allegedly allowing 19 guys to board planes with weapons, fly off course with no radio contact and slam into the towers.

I wonder why nobody was disciplined for this appaling dereliction of duty by so many people

[GenSeneca]

Its a shame that the Bush administration, knowing that an airline could be used by terrorists as a missile didn't deploy better security before 9/11.

And that nobody was disciplined for allegedly allowing 19 guys to board planes with weapons, fly off course with no radio contact and slam into the towers.

I wonder why nobody was disciplined for this appaling dereliction of duty by so many people

Wrong thread Mr. Socialism...

[NO Obamanation]

So today on the Michael Savage show, the obama birth certificate topic came up again. He thinks the reason Obama dashed back to Hawaii was to settle some birth certificate issues.
Turns out there is a second person who is trying "through the courts" to have Obama prove his birth place

Andy Martin Hawaii lawsuit #2 Emergency Motion
ANDY MARTIN
Post Office Box 1851
New York, NY 10150-1851
Toll-free tel. (866) 706-2639
Toll-free fax (866) 707-2639
Temporary Hawai’i
tel. (917) 664-9329
Plaintiff pro se

CIRCUIT COURT OF THE FIRST CIRCUIT
STATE OF HAWAII

CIVIL NUMBER: 08-1-2147-10 BIA

EMERGENCY MOTION
FOR ORDER TO SHOW CAUSE

ANDY MARTIN,

Plaintiff,

vs.

LINDA LINGLE, in her
Official capacity as Governor
Of the State of Hawai’i,
DR. CHIYOME FUKINO, in her
official capacity as Director
of the Department of Health,

Defendants.
_________________________________

EMERGENCY MOTION FOR ORDER TO SHOW CAUSE

Plaintiff ANDY MARTIN (“Plaintiff”), pro se, respectfully moves this Court on an emergency basis for an Order to Show Cause (“OSC”) directing the defendants to show cause on or before October 22, 2008 at a hearing before this Court why the relief requested by the Plaintiff should not be granted.
1. This lawsuit does not involve complicated or disputed facts.
2. Time is of the essence because Plaintiff would like to write columns and articles about the Birth Certificate before November 3, 2008.
3. Plaintiff is physically present in Hawai’i and is available to appear before the Court in person at any hearing on or before October 22, 2008.
4. There is intense national interest in access to an officially certified copy of the birth certificate in question as well as any related supporting information which the defendants may have in their possession.
5. A proposed OSC is attached to this Emergency Motion.

Dated: Honolulu, Hawai’i, October 17, 2008

Respectfully submitted,
ANDY MARTIN
Plaintiff Pro se
http://contrariancommentary.wordpress.com/2008/10/18/andy-martin-hawaii-lawsuit-2-emergency-motion/

[NO Obamanation]

So we are waiting on Dec to see what the S C does about Bergs suit, but yesterday Allan Keys filed a new suit in Calif to stop Calif electoral college votes from going to Obama until he produces his birth certificate.

I know PFOS you hate this thread but it is news, someone did file a new suit so its worth posting.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2132471/posts

[primerib]

Here is another lawsuit filed by Alan Keyes, African American Presidential candidate of the American Independent Party. He says show the f*cking birth certificate.


http://www.soundinvestments.us/files/final_writ_keyes_v_bowen.pdf

[NO Obamanation]

Here is another lawsuit filed by Alan Keyes, African American Presidential candidate of the American Independent Party. He says show the f*cking birth certificate.


http://www.soundinvestments.us/files/final_writ_keyes_v_bowen.pdf

seems easy enough, just show it and all the law suits stop. but I guess I only see it that way because of my tin foil hat :)

[pocketfullofshells]

I am really glad for you that you were able to go. Have you ever read a book called the history of the Irish Race?

no but I Know the book, I worked in a book store for 3+ years . I am reading rebels of Ireland right now, historical fiction.

[pocketfullofshells]

Here is another lawsuit filed by Alan Keyes, African American Presidential candidate of the American Independent Party. He says show the f*cking birth certificate.


http://www.soundinvestments.us/files/final_writ_keyes_v_bowen.pdf

Keys? lol that wack job? what he get 10% of the vote when he ran against him? And you dont even question the motive..


HE FING SHOWED IT < MOVE ON PEOPLE

[pocketfullofshells]

So today on the Michael Savage show, the obama birth certificate topic came up again. He thinks the reason Obama dashed back to Hawaii was to settle some birth certificate issues.
Turns out there is a second person who is trying "through the courts" to have Obama prove his birth place

Andy Martin Hawaii lawsuit #2 Emergency Motion
ANDY MARTIN
Post Office Box 1851
New York, NY 10150-1851
Toll-free tel. (866) 706-2639
Toll-free fax (866) 707-2639
Temporary Hawai’i
tel. (917) 664-9329
Plaintiff pro se

CIRCUIT COURT OF THE FIRST CIRCUIT
STATE OF HAWAII

CIVIL NUMBER: 08-1-2147-10 BIA

EMERGENCY MOTION
FOR ORDER TO SHOW CAUSE

ANDY MARTIN,

Plaintiff,

vs.

LINDA LINGLE, in her
Official capacity as Governor
Of the State of Hawai’i,
DR. CHIYOME FUKINO, in her
official capacity as Director
of the Department of Health,

Defendants.
_________________________________

EMERGENCY MOTION FOR ORDER TO SHOW CAUSE

Plaintiff ANDY MARTIN (“Plaintiff”), pro se, respectfully moves this Court on an emergency basis for an Order to Show Cause (“OSC”) directing the defendants to show cause on or before October 22, 2008 at a hearing before this Court why the relief requested by the Plaintiff should not be granted.
1. This lawsuit does not involve complicated or disputed facts.
2. Time is of the essence because Plaintiff would like to write columns and articles about the Birth Certificate before November 3, 2008.
3. Plaintiff is physically present in Hawai’i and is available to appear before the Court in person at any hearing on or before October 22, 2008.
4. There is intense national interest in access to an officially certified copy of the birth certificate in question as well as any related supporting information which the defendants may have in their possession.
5. A proposed OSC is attached to this Emergency Motion.

Dated: Honolulu, Hawai’i, October 17, 2008

Respectfully submitted,
ANDY MARTIN
Plaintiff Pro se
http://contrariancommentary.wordpress.com/2008/10/18/andy-martin-hawaii-lawsuit-2-emergency-motion/

That is wha he thought, then oddly the reason stated being his Grandmothers health ...that was questioned....seemed pretty damn real did it not? What with her dying and all?

[pocketfullofshells]

seems easy enough, just show it and all the law suits stop. but I guess I only see it that way because of my tin foil hat :)


They can sue him over and over, it does not matter that they are wrong, they can always keep sueing.

Just say it, there is zero he could do that would be proof to you, becuse you dont care about the facts, you just want it to be true.

[NO Obamanation]

They can sue him over and over, it does not matter that they are wrong, they can always keep sueing.

Just say it, there is zero he could do that would be proof to you, becuse you dont care about the facts, you just want it to be true.

Sure he could.

He could give his origional birth certificate to the judge. The judge can check it out and say its a real and valid birth certificate, case closed.

he could have done this a year ago

3 law suites ago

but instead he pays attorneys to go to court to have the case thrown out, or delayed and never shows any documentation.

its only going on because he wont show it to the judge, it could end easily if he shows it.

but it will go on for the next 4 years if he does not.

no matter what we have to get this resolved, the next person to run could have a simular situation and just ignoring it is not the right way to go about it, so even if obama holds out and never shows it we need to make a law so the next person, REPUBLICAN OR DEMOCRAT can not do this again

[pocketfullofshells]

Sure he could.

He could give his origional birth certificate to the judge. The judge can check it out and say its a real and valid birth certificate, case closed.

he could have done this a year ago

3 law suites ago

but instead he pays attorneys to go to court to have the case thrown out, or delayed and never shows any documentation.

its only going on because he wont show it to the judge, it could end easily if he shows it.

but it will go on for the next 4 years if he does not.

no matter what we have to get this resolved, the next person to run could have a simular situation and just ignoring it is not the right way to go about it, so even if obama holds out and never shows it we need to make a law so the next person, REPUBLICAN OR DEMOCRAT can not do this again

you know why else they get thrown out? becuse they are baseless.

[NO Obamanation]

I found another law suit about McCains birth certificate. The person who filed the suit must not have realized that McCain went through this in 2000, and alread provided all of his documentation and birth certificates.

anyways the case was filed in march or april, the judge heard the case in june or july of this year. McCain could have sent attorneys to have it delayed or thrown out but instead he sent attorneys to bring the documentation, the judge saw it and checked it out, 4 days later he dismissed the case. done deal.

it could be just as easy for obama, and what about the next election and the next. we should come up with a vetting process before someone can officially run they are checked out by some bi partisan group for that sort of legal stuff in the future.

[NO Obamanation]

you know why else they get thrown out? becuse they are baseless.

the SC didnt throw it out does that mean its not baseless?

[Andy]

Keys? lol that wack job? what he get 10% of the vote when he ran against him? And you dont even question the motive..


HE FING SHOWED IT < MOVE ON PEOPLE

Then why doesn't the court say he showed it? So you can claim all you want that it was showed. That's fine. Perhaps you can even convince some robots here that it was showed. Great.

The court says it wasn't showed. Go make your case in court and prove to the judge that it was showed, and the problem is solved. Better yet, have Obama himself deliver the stupid certificate to the judge. Then you don't have to prove anything.

Alan Keys is a fine man. No, I don't question the motive because Obama being removed would not benefit Keys in the slightest, whereas other more popular politicians might.

[pocketfullofshells]

http://www.kitv.com/politics/17860890/detail.html?rss=hon&psp=news

once again for those who cant read the first few times this was stated

[pocketfullofshells]

Then why doesn't the court say he showed it? So you can claim all you want that it was showed. That's fine. Perhaps you can even convince some robots here that it was showed. Great.

The court says it wasn't showed. Go make your case in court and prove to the judge that it was showed, and the problem is solved. Better yet, have Obama himself deliver the stupid certificate to the judge. Then you don't have to prove anything.

Alan Keys is a fine man. No, I don't question the motive because Obama being removed would not benefit Keys in the slightest, whereas other more popular politicians might.


Keys has no motive? realy? none, you dont think that the guy who a few years ago got crushed by Obama , would have any motive to attack Him ?

Why dont you show proof he is not a US Citizen? Why dont you show that the courts, all keep throwing these things out for anything other then the fact they are baseless? Its your side making the claims, but you want all the proof from the other side.

[NO Obamanation]

Keys has no motive? realy? none, you dont think that the guy who a few years ago got crushed by Obama , would have any motive to attack Him ?

Why dont you show proof he is not a US Citizen? Why dont you show that the courts, all keep throwing these things out for anything other then the fact they are baseless? Its your side making the claims, but you want all the proof from the other side.

You just got done slamming me for having an opinion on if obama is a christian or not

that was bad because it was baseless, I had no proof


now you ten seconds later are saying keys is doing this to get obama back becaue obama beat him in a race, but what is your proof? what did he say to make you think this ?

do you always go around judging people like that? isnt there a saying about beariing false witness?

[pocketfullofshells]

You just got done slamming me for having an opinion on if obama is a christian or not

that was bad because it was baseless, I had no proof


now you ten seconds later are saying keys is doing this to get obama back becaue obama beat him in a race, but what is your proof? what did he say to make you think this ?

do you always go around judging people like that? isnt there a saying about beariing false witness?

I said he has a motive, that is reason to question a lawsuit. I did not say its the only reason, but he has motive and a logical person would have to take that into account.

Also I am not Christan.

[NO Obamanation]

I said he has a motive, that is reason to question a lawsuit. I did not say its the only reason, but he has motive and a logical person would have to take that into account.

Also I am not Christan.

I said obama had political gain from the church and he did he had motive for going to that church even if he didnt buy into the chrisitan part or the racist part

I am also not a christian :)

[pocketfullofshells]

I said obama had political gain from the church and he did he had motive for going to that church even if he didnt buy into the chrisitan part or the racist part

I am also not a christian :)

you said he was not a christian, you had nothing to back that up, just like all your other dumb ideas about him.

[NO Obamanation]

you said he was not a christian, you had nothing to back that up, just like all your other dumb ideas about him.

I dont think he is, by his actions I dont think he is, and I know you said you are not but if you told me you were, I wouldnt be so stupid as to believe it.

christian isnt something you say you are, its something you live. IMO

that is what christian means to me

[pocketfullofshells]

I dont think he is, by his actions I dont think he is, and I know you said you are not but if you told me you were, I wouldnt be so stupid as to believe it.

christian isnt something you say you are, its something you live. IMO

that is what christian means to me

well if your not one, then who realy cares what you think makes a christian?

And I know I am a godless heathen who is evil and wicked . I am immoral.

[NO Obamanation]

well if your not one, then who realy cares what you think makes a christian?

And I know I am a godless heathen who is evil and wicked . I am immoral.

I never thought you cared what I think, I think you just like to argue with me :)

You may be a godless heathen, I dunno but I highly doubt you are evil or wicked