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As we face yet another Detroit Bailout

Discussion in 'U.S. Politics' started by Unite Our Nation, Nov 6, 2008.

  1. Unite Our Nation

    Unite Our Nation New Member

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    Does anyone believe that bailing out the auto industry again will produce different results? I don't. The very definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing, expecting different results. The problems that face these car makers are still there. They need to fix their problems before taking yet more money from the American's Pockets!!!



    "For that guy elected yesterday, a puzzle is how Detroit's auto makers should be reshaped by the hand of government -- with a taxpayer bailout or by letting bankruptcy judges take charge? Both fixes have their fans, yet neither would really solve the industry's essential problem.


    CorbisHere's a better idea, one you haven't heard before, involving a contemporary curse word seldom used in the debate over the auto makers: "deregulation."

    No, Washington wouldn't have to find the courage to amend the labor laws to end the Detroit Three's captivity by the UAW. Nor would it have to repeal the CAFE rules that are now a sacred cow. It would simply have to allow auto makers to meet the fuel economy standards with any mix of autos made in domestic or overseas factories.

    Under the nonsensical "two fleet" rule that now applies, manufacturers meet the standards separately with their "domestically" and "nondomestically" produced fleets. What does this have to do with making sure U.S. consumers get good mileage? Nothing. It's a naked handout to the UAW at the expense of the companies and their customers.

    How dumb is the two-fleet rule? Nissan, in a petition for its removal, points out foreign brands may actually minimize the domestic content in their U.S. cars so they can continue to count as "nondomestic."

    How dumb is the rule? Chrysler might not be unraveling today if not for the two-fleet rule, the real genesis of the Hail Marys it's been throwing in all directions to find an electric car or a small-car partner or to merge with GM. Chrysler has a perfectly salvageable business making trucks, minivans, muscle cars and Jeeps -- doomed only by the lack of enough small, fuel-efficient cars to roll out of a UAW factory with a Chrysler emblem slapped on.

    For 30 years, to make and sell the large vehicles that earn their profits, the Detroit Three have been effectively required to build small cars in high-wage, UAW factories, though it means losing money on every car. (That -- not some perverse desire to make bad cars -- is why they skimped for decades on styling, engineering and materials in their family sedans.)

    Sure, this bullet would be far from silver and would still cause pain. The UAW might declare war to stop production from being shifted offshore. The Big Three might have to pay billions in job buyouts to use their new freedom. Since 2005, they've had some leeway under Nafta to shift "domestic" production to Mexico and haven't done much about it.

    But here's the key: Detroit would finally get what every foreign competitor and just about every other business has -- normal leverage over labor costs. Auto jobs wouldn't automatically flee offshore. The Big Three would rather hire high-quality U.S. workers -- but on the same terms that Toyota or Nissan or BMW do.

    Let's not kid ourselves that a taxpayer rescue would be anything but a down payment on a never-ending bailout. The bailout already is never-ending: Chrysler was already rescued once. Forgotten are the Reagan-era import quotas that inflated the price of every car sold in America to help prop up the Big Three. If hooked up to Washington life supports today, Detroit's first assignment would be to "protect jobs" -- job protection guarantees being one of the Big Three's fatal errors in the first place."
     
  2. Unite Our Nation

    Unite Our Nation New Member

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    Second part of the article from WSJ

    "Meanwhile, a bankruptcy judge can only void contracts, not laws. Not only would the UAW's labor monopoly remain intact, but the union is a major creditor of the Big Three and would likely become a major shareholder in any reorganized auto maker.

    With or without a taxpayer rescue or the ministrations of a bankruptcy court, breaking the labor monopoly is the step without which Detroit will remain the problem child of American industrial policy. And, lo, what would be politically unthinkable under any other circumstances is quite doable if styled a tweak to the fuel-economy rules. In last year's CAFE bill, the Senate actually voted to get rid of two-fleet, though it crept back via a House-Senate conference.

    The UAW, of course, has different ideas. The union expects Congress to pass new "card check" legislation to speed union takeovers of nonunion companies. Rather than reducing Detroit's domestic costs, why not raise Toyota's and Honda's? Then what about the cars they produce in their overseas factories? If Reagan could be buffaloed into imposing "voluntary" import quotas to keep GM afloat, why not a president what's-his-name?
    The stakes here are even bigger than they seem. Detroit's bad news could be America's worse news if the industry's year of living extra miserably starts the whole economy down the road to protectionism and taxpayer-financed industrial cronyism.
     
  3. Libsmasher

    Libsmasher New Member

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    Let 'em crash. This is a great opportunity to get rid of smokestack industries that should have been ex[ported long ago. And wasn't it democrats who were always biitching about corporate welfare? :D Even in the recent election. Now pelosi is "in talks" with the auto makers. AHHHHH HA HA HA! :D
     
  4. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    .......and reduce the carbon footprint...don't forget you're now in the anti-carbon club boys and girls!!?? All those nasty cars polluting the air...urghhhh..... get rid of those vile ancient edifices dedicated to the gods of pollution and industrial waste and come hither and worship at the alter of carbon neutral loveliness.
     
  5. pocketfullofshells

    pocketfullofshells Well-Known Member

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    So you think the way to get US autos going it let them get worse gas mpg? Do you know why they are being outsold? It has zero and I mean Zero to do with regulations, it has to do with one simple thing. American car companies are 5+ years behind the times in terms of what people wanted. Want a new card I can get a car that gets a lot better mpg with Honda or Toyota.
    I sold cars for Ford, I know, it was never oo there is to much regulation it was that they had better cars, my dad even was going to get a car from a overseas company even though I had the employee discount because of the extra mileage for a car the same price range and style. While the companies overseas are making hybrids small cars and all that, over here we have Hummers and Chrysler making the most inefficient line they can and there big thing is pay 299 for gas for 4 years ( also known as 1 buck more then it cost right now) they are short sighted and not listening to cust needs today, and predicting what they will want later. This is about companies that did a poor job in doing what there main goal is, make things people want to buy. and that is why they are failing, regulations are nothing. Many cars from Japan are made here in the US, and they all have th same regulations.
     
  6. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

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    its so funny how the dems are always trying to save a whale or a flower even to the point of shoving it down everybodys throat like we are all linda lovelace or something.....but when it comes to a human baby...........we all get to choice
     
  7. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

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    obama and co. should just tell them to suck it up and tell his useless followers to ride the bus or get a bicycle

    I am tired of the bail outs that are not working and with obama and co. not wanting to drill for oil and also not wanting to buy oil, not much need for a car that runs on oil.
     
  8. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    holly moley... well there's a name I've not heard in a long time :D
     
  9. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

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    I wondered if you would know who I am talking about :)


    but gosh dang that is what I feel like, all these libs shoving their ideas down my throat and thinking some how I am going to like it!
     
  10. pocketfullofshells

    pocketfullofshells Well-Known Member

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    funny cuz who was it that was saying we had to bail out the banks? Was that not Bush, the Republican?

    I was against that bail out and I would not support bailing out the auto companies, and I fought against northwest airlines here in MN being bailed out twice ( and now them moved anyway )

    many of my Liberal freinds here all agree with me as well.
     
  11. Libsmasher

    Libsmasher New Member

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    Uh, no thanks - I've opted out of religion - especially preposterous ones. ;)
     
  12. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

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    i was and am against bail outs

    it did not pass the first time due to republicans and when it finally past it was mostly republicans who voted AGAINST it

    it was your messiah that voted for it, and riddled with cancer mccain the old man who will be dead in 2 months

    you can blame them but the conservative republicans in the house voted against it
     
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