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Breaking the shackles of faith

Discussion in 'U.S. Politics' started by rejs7, May 31, 2007.

  1. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    If America is so minded it could completely, and irrevocably, end once and for all the idea that church and state have the right to co-exist. As is clearly stated in the bible all chrisitans must give to Ceaser what is Ceaser etc, and the constitution also states irrafuteably that church & state must be seperated. Why then are the religious nut jobs determined to turn the law on its head, and make the rest of the country suffer a '1000 year reich' of christian oppression?

    Is it because the rest of the citizens are like sheep, and are afraid to break away from the flock, or is it that the average citizen is more than comfortable in their own sty, and feel that it is needless to go wallow in their neighbours? Ultimately only a citizen wide backlash against the this fascism will work, but the media will not act for fear of their sponsorship being taken away by corporate america - where are the brave and the free? Where are the John Brown's and Luther Kings of this day and age?
     
  2. Think for myself

    Think for myself New Member

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    The "render unto Cesar" phrase was added centuries after the life of Jesus to ensure that all good Christians paid their taxes.
     
  3. 9sublime

    9sublime Active Member

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    Which means you should question the accuracy of the rest of the Bible and when it was written/changed.
     
  4. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    Exactly - the KJV is riddled with translation errors, and the various scandels amongst the religious leadership do not seem to have dented the nations enthusiasm for wandering in the dark subjugation of false gods.
     
  5. USMC the Almighty

    USMC the Almighty New Member

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    Irrefutably? Please point me to the part of the Constitution where the Framers said they want a complete "separation of church and state".

    Christian oppression? 99% of the Christians I know (I am not a Christian, btw) are the nicest people I know, who only do good deeds. They go to Church on Sundays, volunteer their time during the week, give money to charity, hold gatherings for their friends, etc.

    I've never heard a Christian stand up and declare that they want to make the country "suffer a 100 year Reich" of oppression, though I have heard both Muslims and atheists say that.

    What Fascism? America isn't even close to Fascist. Fascism means, among other things, there are no unions of any kind, there is only one political party, there is a wide propaganda effort through a controlled and one-sided mass media, there is regulation on what individuals can do personally to themselves, there is a restriction on discussion and criticism of the government, and the widespread employment of terror tactics (e.g. the gulag).

    Does this sound like an accurate description of modern America?

    To put John Brown and Martin Luther King in the same sense is irony of the highest order.
     
  6. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    Unfortunatly what 100 may want, and what 1 powerful person does are two completely different things. I have some wonderful christian friends, but I also know some pretty nasty christian bigots. 1 person, 1 group, 1 sect tarnishes the whole, makes the barrel of apples go sour, and makes the rest of the world view the 99 good as part of the 1 bad.

    As far as fascism is concerned America has done a pretty good job of turning itself into a far right nation - yes there are voices of descent, but they are drowned out by the GOP's desire to cling onto power. We in the UK watch on in horror as the democrats meekly give in to their demands, and unless there is a mass awakening then the country is sleep walking (or rather sitting on the sofa thinking about walking) its way into oblivion.
     
  7. USMC the Almighty

    USMC the Almighty New Member

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    Fair enough.

    America is turning into a "far right nation" with the left's voices of "dissent being drowned out by the GOP's desire to cling onto power". Do you realize how ridiculous of a statement this is considering the results of the 2006 midterm elections?

    Likewise, we here in the U.S. watch on in horror as your country continues to be invaded by Muslims while your government and populace lacks the backbone to stand up to the Islamic fundamentalists.
     
  8. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    Actually the idea that we are being invaded by muslims is a fallacy - we only have about 5% of the population that claim to muslim. As far as having a backbone regarding islamofascists is concerned we prefer to get on with in and do it quietly. We do not need a patriot act, or a big media circus to deal with the bigots who twist the quaran for their own ends.

    If you have ever heard of Abu Hamza then you will know that we deal with them in a firm and strict matter.
     
  9. USMC the Almighty

    USMC the Almighty New Member

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    Islam is Britain's largest minority and grows at a threatening pace.

    1 MI5 equals 100 PATRIOT Acts.
     
  10. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    Only if you listen and read the Sun/Daily Mirror or any other Murdoch inspire trash. Muslims get on fairly well with the rest of society, and just as the Irish were perceived as a threat 15-30 years ago, now it is the turn of the Muslim. Irish terrorists did far more to harm this country than the 7/7 bombings, yet Americans funded them to their hearts content until 9/11 - sheer hypocrasy.

    If MI5 = 100 patriot acts to paraphrase Mr T "damn fool! Quit your jibber jabber!" The patriot act is insidious, perniscious, and the stuff far right dreams are made of. Next time there is a major disaster or terrorist 'incident' the president can rule by decree, and congress can whistle dixie becuase they can no longer call him to order over it.
     
  11. jb_1430

    jb_1430 New Member

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    What idiocy. Paranoid delusions on a grand scale. Almost funny coming from a bloat whos every breath is at the pleasure of the queen, the head of the national church. MARK
     
  12. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    The fact that we have a monach is neither here nor there - just because we let the houser of windsor have a titular role in our lives is no different than letting the Bush or Kennedy's rule. The queen has very little actual power, rather is there as a stabilising element in British politics.

    Anyhow - this is a red hering - the shakles of faith I was refering to is the idea that religion and politics can mix. You can have your faith, but in no way should it interfer with your duty as a public servant - in this country it is unacceptable for a polititian to use faith as a reason (or excuse) for a policy.
     
  13. jb_1430

    jb_1430 New Member

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    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!! Oh ye of little knowledge. It is not you that allows the house of Windsor to have anything, but is instead the house of windsor who has granted you every right that you have, including representation in the Parliament.

    The Queen has IMMENSE power that she chooses not to exercise. The Monarch granted much of its power to the Parliament and has the authority to take it away.


    LOLOLOLOL!!! Riiiight. What is it, 30 seats in the house of Lords reserved for the clergy? And they are free to use any reason whatsoever for a policy. When the queen was coronated she swore to maintain the Protestant religion and when the next Prince takes over he will swear to the same thing.
    And what policy or laws are you refering to in the US? MARK
     
  14. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    If you read British history you will know that at the end of the 19th century the monarch was stripped of all but the most cursory of direct powers - if the Queen tried to exert her direct powers the likelyhood would be that thegovernment of the day would introduce legislation to abolish the monarchy and bring in a republic.

    As far as the house of Lords is concerned it too was brought to heel in 1911 under the House of Lords act which makes the house of commons the prime chamber - plus this year we have introduced legislation to do away with the lords, and bring in a new chamber within the next few years.

    As far as America is concerned please point me to a president who was not from an elite family? Carter, Reagan, Bush and Kennedy all had big money behind them, and as such no working class candidate has ever been able to garner enough support from the moneymen.
     
  15. jb_1430

    jb_1430 New Member

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    I detect a slithering from your topic on religion to another, seeking refuge from the first.
    Carter was a peanut farmer, born into a family of modest means. Clinton's father was a traveling salesman, his stepfather was part owner of a small auto dealership, a compulsive gambler and alchoholic. Reagans family was barely middle class. Nixon was born to middle class Quaker parents. Lyndon Johnson was born into poverty. You dont have the slightest idea what you are talking about. MARK
     
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