Hello

No, dear. . .NOT "kill LIFE BABIES," but not use heroic measure to "save" later development FETUS who were not "liveable" without those heroic measures, and were too under developped or suffer from such disabilities that they would NEVER have survived past a few days. ?

Heroic measures do not include food and water, those are just normal decent things human beings should do for eachother. These are fully developed human beings who survived abortions and were put in a dirty laundry closet and left till dead.
 
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Obviously, you provided "catholic" resources to begin with!

But, after going to your other source, all I can see is that Obama trusted in individual physicians' following their conscience and their oath to save a life IF they thought there was a life to save, without having to result to calling a second or a third opinion in the room. ?

I quickly googled the topic and posted the first three links. I dont know how good they were. You should already be fully aware of this topic since you are such a supporter. There is much more information to find if you are willing but I dont have time to dig up the interviews and the information for you on a topic you should have already been fully informed about
 
I sure wish you and your "anti health care for all" supporters would be as consciencious about providing "heroic measures" for older children, and for adults, and for elderlies, who are in need of those immensly costly procedures. . .and do not get them because they cannot pay.

Now. . .who would have paid for the heroic measures applied to those late term fetus whose parents had already decided would not live?. . .The hospital? The doctor?


I would be more than happy to help pay for the life of a child. But you should realize the cost would be much lower if the abortionist would not have tried to kill the child on their way out of the womb

It is the "mother" who decides if there is value in her child and abortionist who kills her child and politicians who voted to let them decide on what baby lives or dies who does the deciding unfortunately.

What you call heroic actually sends chills up my spine.
 
I would be more than happy to help pay for the life of a child. But you should realize the cost would be much lower if the abortionist would not have tried to kill the child on their way out of the womb

It is the "mother" who decides if there is value in her child and abortionist who kills her child and politicians who voted to let them decide on what baby lives or dies who does the deciding unfortunately.

What you call heroic actually sends chills up my spine.

Do you know what the term "heroic measures" means in medicine?
It means engaging in treatments that willcertainly cause even more damage or suffering, with little chance of cure or even prolonging death, basically a last chance attempt to prolong the life of someone who would certainly die in very short term if those heroic measures are not attempted.

Now, you are probably wondering why anyone would choose to not engage in those measures if a fetus is born breathing (outside of the cost which is usually huge). Well, here is one example that gives both a common reason why a woman would choose to have a late term abortion, and why letting a non liveable fetus die without engaging in heroic measures may in fact save more lifes:
sorry, I wanted to do a copy and paste, and I lost the text, so I will need to go copy it again.

Here is the article:
[QUOT3. ANENCEPHALIC BABIES (sample)

The literal meaning of anencephaly is "no brain." But the term is not exactly accurate for

an = negative*****enkephalos = brain

describing the condition of anencephalic babies. Such babies have no cerebrum or cerebellum but they do have a brain stem. The brain stem allows them to breathe and allows their hearts to beat. But the babies cannot see, hear, or feel anything. They will never be able to think or achieve what is called "personhood."

Anencephalic babies are thus not technically brain dead. Yet there is general consensus that heroic measures should not be used to keep them alive. In fact, anencephaly may be one of the few medical conditions that all doctors agree is futile to treat.

About 1000 anencephalic babies are born in the United States each year. The condition can be diagnosed prenatally, and most women (about 95%) who learn that they will have an anencephalic child choose to have an abortion. Of the 5% of the anencephalic infants who are born, about 55% are stillborn. The rest?the remaining 1000?are said to be "born dying."

Sometimes the parents of an anencephalic infant want to donate the infant's organs to other babies who need healthy organs. They say that, by donating the newborn's organs, they feel that the pregnancy would at least have had some value: their own loss can be another family's gain. In the United States, about 2000 babies each year need organs, and the only suitable organs for tiny babies are those from other tiny babies.

Organs cannot, however, be removed from individuals who are alive, and anencephalic babies, though born dying, are not dead. Thus, the debates have raged about whether it is appropriate to make an exception exclusively with anencephalic infants, changing the definition of "dead" in their case so that needed organs can be removed in time to be of use.

In 1992, for example, the parents of an anencephalic baby named Baby Theresa wanted to donate her organs. But the courts, all the way to the Florida Supreme Court, would not declare her dead. She lived for ten days. When she died, her organs could no longer be transplanted. On the day of her death, Baby Theresa's parents and a surgeon appeared on the Phil Donahue Show to talk about the need to change the law, so that organs from infants like Baby Theresa could be made available to others.E][/QUOTE]
 
Do you know what the term "heroic measures" means in medicine?
It means engaging in treatments that willcertainly cause even more damage or suffering, with little chance of cure or even prolonging death, basically a last chance attempt to prolong the life of someone who would certainly die in very short term if those heroic measures are not attempted.

Now, you are probably wondering why anyone would choose to not engage in those measures if a fetus is born breathing (outside of the cost which is usually huge). Well, here is one example that gives both a common reason why a woman would choose to have a late term abortion, and why letting a non liveable fetus die without engaging in heroic measures may in fact save more lifes:
sorry, I wanted to do a copy and paste, and I lost the text, so I will need to go copy it again.

Here is the article:
[QUOT3. ANENCEPHALIC BABIES (sample)

The literal meaning of anencephaly is "no brain." But the term is not exactly accurate for

an = negative*****enkephalos = brain

describing the condition of anencephalic babies. Such babies have no cerebrum or cerebellum but they do have a brain stem. The brain stem allows them to breathe and allows their hearts to beat. But the babies cannot see, hear, or feel anything. They will never be able to think or achieve what is called "personhood."

Anencephalic babies are thus not technically brain dead. Yet there is general consensus that heroic measures should not be used to keep them alive. In fact, anencephaly may be one of the few medical conditions that all doctors agree is futile to treat.

About 1000 anencephalic babies are born in the United States each year. The condition can be diagnosed prenatally, and most women (about 95%) who learn that they will have an anencephalic child choose to have an abortion. Of the 5% of the anencephalic infants who are born, about 55% are stillborn. The rest?the remaining 1000?are said to be "born dying."

Sometimes the parents of an anencephalic infant want to donate the infant's organs to other babies who need healthy organs. They say that, by donating the newborn's organs, they feel that the pregnancy would at least have had some value: their own loss can be another family's gain. In the United States, about 2000 babies each year need organs, and the only suitable organs for tiny babies are those from other tiny babies.

Organs cannot, however, be removed from individuals who are alive, and anencephalic babies, though born dying, are not dead. Thus, the debates have raged about whether it is appropriate to make an exception exclusively with anencephalic infants, changing the definition of "dead" in their case so that needed organs can be removed in time to be of use.

In 1992, for example, the parents of an anencephalic baby named Baby Theresa wanted to donate her organs. But the courts, all the way to the Florida Supreme Court, would not declare her dead. She lived for ten days. When she died, her organs could no longer be transplanted. On the day of her death, Baby Theresa's parents and a surgeon appeared on the Phil Donahue Show to talk about the need to change the law, so that organs from infants like Baby Theresa could be made available to others.E]
[/QUOTE]



I am talking about full term babies who are born alive and generally healthy (except the damage an abortionist did while delivering them) and left to die in a dirty laundry room. Babies that are targeted to die for no other reason than their "moms" did not want them and did not care to adopt them out. Giving food, water and comfort are not heroic measures, its normal human treatment of each other.
 



I am talking about full term babies who are born alive and generally healthy (except the damage an abortionist did while delivering them) and left to die in a dirty laundry room. Babies that are targeted to die for no other reason than their "moms" did not want them and did not care to adopt them out. Giving food, water and comfort are not heroic measures, its normal human treatment of each other.[/QUOTE]

then you are talking about such exceptional circumstances that it falls under no law. these circumstances are the same as killing an infant, real crimes that have nothing to do with the Abortion debate or the FEW late term abortions that ARE permitted under the law.

NO ONE condone that kind of crime. NO ONE believes that a liveavle, healthy fetus should be left to die, but even in your extremely biased sources, it doesn't state that those fetus were healthy and liveable.

I believe your intentions are ggood, but you are focusing on exceptional and criminal cases, that have NOTHING to do with the law but have more to do with infanticide, similar to children being thrown in public trash cans, or thrown on walls, or abused to the point of death, because thy are not wanted, or because they have the terrible fate to be boen to criminal parents, or to uneducated, scared teenagers, who SHOULD have had an early term abortion to prevent the suffering and the heartache.
 
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NO ONE condone that kind of crime. NO ONE believes that a liveavle, healthy fetus should be left to die, but even in your extremely biased sources, it doesn't state that those fetus were healthy and liveable .


They were not healthy after the abortionist got ahold of them that’s for sure.

The point is you asked me what I had against obama. And I mentioned one of the bigger issues. He voted no on a bill that would protect babies from being put in dirty laundry rooms to die and another time blocked the same vote and twice voted present on it. After hearing the testimony of a nurse who witnessed this happen more than a few times. He also once kept the issue of protecting these children from coming to the floor for a vote.

I have a number of things against the man politically; this is probably the top one for me.

You can justify in your own mind the killing of babies, you can even rationalize it as something good but some of us just can’t ever see it that way.

Anyways, this is something that would keep me from ever having any respect of any kind for Obama, his ability to ignore and not help children when he was informed they were being left to die in dirty laundry rooms makes him sub human in my book.
 
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