Insurance companies don't ration health care

[Rick]

What they do is sell a product that is very expensive, so some can't afford it.

WHY is it expensive?

In one word: GOVERNMENT

Who allowed the 20 million illegal aliens in, who get free care at the ER, which is then cost-shifted to paying customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who creates many state laws making interstate competition unfeasible for insurance companies, giving near-monopoly status to a few big insurers inside the state, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has utterly failed to end massive medicare and medicaid fraud, reducing the amount of money that health providers can be reimbursed, causing cost-shifting to regular customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has failed to rein in the John Edwards style tort law lawyer predators, who grow super-wealthy looting physicians and other health care providers, causing their liability insurance rates to rise, their prices to patients to rise, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has failed to defend the intellectual property rights of US pharamceutical companies and medical device manufacturers, causing higher prices for us patients, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

 

[Gipper]

What they do is sell a product that is very expensive, so some can't afford it.

WHY is it expensive?

In one word: GOVERNMENT

Who allowed the 20 million illegal aliens in, who get free care at the ER, which is then cost-shifted to paying customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who creates many state laws making interstate competition unfeasible for insurance companies, giving near-monopoly status to a few big insurers inside the state, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has utterly failed to end massive medicare and medicaid fraud, reducing the amount of money that health providers can be reimbursed, causing cost-shifting to regular customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has failed to rein in the John Edwards style tort law lawyer predators, who grow super-wealthy looting physicians and other health care providers, causing their liability insurance rates to rise, their prices to patients to rise, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Who has failed to defend the intellectual property rights of US pharamceutical companies and medical device manufacturers, causing higher prices for us patients, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Well said and I could not agree more.

As the Great One said, "Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem."

Wherever major problems exist in our great nation, one can find the incompetent heavy hand of government. And yet, no one in government seems to care. And, many liberals think more control by government is needed to fix the problem caused by government. Its insanity!!!

Another terrible example of governments incompetence and complete failure, are the public schools. Sad. Very sad.

 

[dogtowner]

What they do is sell a product that is very expensive, so some can't afford it.

WHY is it expensive?

In one word: GOVERNMENT

amen to that

Who allowed the 20 million illegal aliens in, who get free care at the ER, which is then cost-shifted to paying customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

amen to that

Who creates many state laws making interstate competition unfeasible for insurance companies, giving near-monopoly status to a few big insurers inside the state, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

not true. insurance companies can set up shop in any state tehy wish but they have to adhere to the requirements of each state. so if you can't understand why that Aetna policy in Wisc is 4k and in NY its 12 K, go talk to the Insurance comminnioner and legislature in NY about why it is that way.

still government though

Who has utterly failed to end massive medicare and medicaid fraud, reducing the amount of money that health providers can be reimbursed, causing cost-shifting to regular customers, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

Medicare and Medicaid are hugely responsible for runnig up costs as private companies just follow along.

Who has failed to rein in the John Edwards style tort law lawyer predators, who grow super-wealthy looting physicians and other health care providers, causing their liability insurance rates to rise, their prices to patients to rise, causing insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

gotta HATE defensive medicine. that's the other 50% of why costs soar.

Who has failed to defend the intellectual property rights of US pharamceutical companies and medical device manufacturers, causing higher prices for us patients, causing their insurance premiums to go up?

GOVERNMENT

government and pharma share guilt here

 

[Rick]

What I left off about the tort lawyer predators: not only do they push patient health care premiums up by driving up health care providers' liability insurance premiums, they also drive them up because doctors prescribe expensive tests they otherwise wouldn't to defend themselves - ie, defensive medicine.

 

[dogtowner]

What I left off about the tort lawyer predators: not only do they push patient health care premiums up by driving up health care providers' liability insurance premiums, they also drive them up because doctors prescribe expensive tests they otherwise wouldn't to defend themselves - ie, defensive medicine.

patients get tests because the malpractice insurance companies lawyers say they must have to defend against lawsuits. put a little blame on the AMA for utterly failing to police their own.

 

[Rick]

patients get tests because the malpractice insurance companies lawyers say they must have to defend against lawsuits. put a little blame on the AMA for utterly failing to police their own.

Sorry, I don't think that says it exactly. Don't confuse the proximate cause (AMA) with the ultimate root cause - lawyer jackals.

 

[dogtowner]

Sorry, I don't think that says it exactly. Don't confuse the proximate cause (AMA) with the ultimate root cause - lawyer jackals.

if the AMA polices it's own, the threat of malpractice diminishes as there are fewer LEGITIMATE cases filed. The media runs with any story involvig a doc who just moves here and there hurting people all along the way and it effects people's perceptions to where they are not outraged at malpractice cases taking off. The MSm would have been just as happy reporting a X% drop in doctors nationwide as a result of kicking the bums out.

lawyers will go for whatever low hanging fruit there is, its what they do. just dont give them the opening.

 

[Rick]

if the AMA polices it's own, the threat of malpractice diminishes as there are fewer LEGITIMATE cases filed. The media runs with any story involvig a doc who just moves here and there hurting people all along the way and it effects people's perceptions to where they are not outraged at malpractice cases taking off. The MSm would have been just as happy reporting a X% drop in doctors nationwide as a result of kicking the bums out.

lawyers will go for whatever low hanging fruit there is, its what they do. just dont give them the opening.

Some doctors will inevitably make mistakes. Their insurers should pay. That isn't the issue. The issue isn't $6 million awarded for compensatory damages, it's $50 million (or $100 million or whatever) awarded for punitive or pain-and-suffering damages, by uninformed juries manipulated by sharp tort lawyres.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

If you are not smart enough to know that Health care is always Rationed, then there is not point in talking about the other stuff your wrong on here.

 

[Dr.Who]

If you are not smart enough to know that Health care is always Rationed, then there is not point in talking about the other stuff your wrong on here.

"Rationing is the controlled [in this case controlled by government]* distribution of scarce resources, goods, or services. Rationing controls the size of the ration, one's allotted portion of the resources being distributed on a particular day or at a particular time."

*brackets are mine.

When you cannot afford something that is not rationing. The fact that no single person in this country lacks basic health care proves that it is not presently rationed.

 

[Dr.Who]

Well said and I could not agree more.

As the Great One said, "Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem."

Wherever major problems exist in our great nation, one can find the incompetent heavy hand of government. And yet, no one in government seems to care. And, many liberals think more control by government is needed to fix the problem caused by government. Its insanity!!!

Another terrible example of governments incompetence and complete failure, are the public schools. Sad. Very sad.

I agree.

 

[dogtowner]

If you are not smart enough to know that Health care is always Rationed, then there is not point in talking about the other stuff your wrong on here.

Care is bought (outside self insurance) by health insurance which is bought by the customer (individual or employer). What care is covered is entirely a matter of what is negotiated for and written into the contract. The rationing you incorrectly call it is nohting of the sort but rather determined by the terms of the contract. With government insurance there is no negotiation.

Big difference.

The custopmer wished to keep insurance costs down (naturally enough) so its not shocking that they are content to trade lifetime maximums and such for less bite each paycheck.

The problem we have is not that there is a problem with health insurance, its a problem with the costs of care. Nobody is addressign that.

 

[Rick]

If you are not smart enough to know that Health care is always Rationed, then there is not point in talking about the other stuff your wrong on here.

Do you ever feel FOOLISH jumping into a thread like this, with no facts and no arguments, just to throw one of your trademark puff balls? You certainly LOOK foolish.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Care is bought (outside self insurance) by health insurance which is bought by the customer (individual or employer). What care is covered is entirely a matter of what is negotiated for and written into the contract. The rationing you incorrectly call it is nohting of the sort but rather determined by the terms of the contract. With government insurance there is no negotiation.

Big difference.

The custopmer wished to keep insurance costs down (naturally enough) so its not shocking that they are content to trade lifetime maximums and such for less bite each paycheck.


The problem we have is not that there is a problem with health insurance, its a problem with the costs of care. Nobody is addressign that.

yes, and that contract is negotiated with the fact that you have limited amount of cash...and need health care..but I guess in your world we all have unlimited money to buy insurance with right?

my health care choices with my income where basically limited to...2 choices...whooo! 2 . Unless I wanted to not go threw work and pay alot more to get less...or have so little coverage it does not even cover the cost os the plan. I have seen health care plans sooo limited that you had to basically max out the use of everything...just to make up the cost of the plan per yer. Those are not health care plans..they are scams.

Also you know what would help alot with the cost I bet? Public Option...or single payer...but you don't want those so...

I just yesterday went with my GF would have to pick up some prescription pills...235 bucks...10 pills...and yes they where Generic..And not covered by insurance...She has insurance...pretty good even...she makes nearly 60,000 a year, lives with mom rent free...has a paid off used car...and she is very often broke or does not have a lot of money...all from medical costs ...so trust me I know about the costs of health care...it sucks...but nothing the Republicans have put forth changes that...or the fact that if she had lost her insurance coverage sooner then she did when she got laid off...she could be doing alot worse...because her surgery would not be covered under her new insurance...and also could have been listed as pre existing as well.

 

[dogtowner]

yes, and that contract is negotiated with the fact that you have limited amount of cash...and need health care..but I guess in your world we all have unlimited money to buy insurance with right?

you have as much cash as you wish to have relative to the worth of the product in negotiation. Yu can have Cadillac health coverage or Yugo health coverage and you will get what you are willing to pay for.

my health care choices with my income where basically limited to...2 choices...whooo! 2 . Unless I wanted to not go threw work and pay alot more to get less...or have so little coverage it does not even cover the cost os the plan. I have seen health care plans sooo limited that you had to basically max out the use of everything...just to make up the cost of the plan per yer. Those are not health care plans..they are scams.

If your company had reaon to believe that it's employees (not just you) were willig to pony up more for better coverage they would see to it. Fact is, they now thats not going to happen.

Also you know what would help alot with the cost I bet? Public Option...or single payer...but you don't want those so...

Wont make any difference because it does nothing to reduce the cost of care. If you do nothing to reduce cost of care ANY insurance is going to cost a lot. And with the government's horrid record on fraud (they are proud to admit how little they spend to combat it in the ultimate irony), it would only be worse.

I just yesterday went with my GF would have to pick up some prescription pills...235 bucks...10 pills...and yes they where Generic..And not covered by insurance...She has insurance...pretty good even...she makes nearly 60,000 a year, lives with mom rent free...has a paid off used car...and she is very often broke or does not have a lot of money...all from medical costs ...so trust me I know about the costs of health care...it sucks...but nothing the Republicans have put forth changes that...or the fact that if she had lost her insurance coverage sooner then she did when she got laid off...she could be doing alot worse...because her surgery would not be covered under her new insurance...and also could have been listed as pre existing as well.

At least you are admitting the problem.is cost of care. That's a start. That government has made the RX problem worse than it need be is even worse but thats obviously a bi-partisan matter (note obama helped make it worse with obamacare as sometimes pointed out by lefties).

Americans have been bamboozled into thinking insurance was the problem when it was, in fact, cost of care. Why ? Scratch the surface and you'll see its government in bed with AMA and RX etc etc etc.