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Islam fears women

Discussion in 'Culture & Religion' started by rejs7, Jun 6, 2007.

  1. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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  2. OPGhostdog

    OPGhostdog New Member

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    Damn!!!! I don't care what the video shown about Muslim women
    being attacked. That's a bunch of political bull****. In the Muslim
    world women is the next best thing to Allah aka GOD. In Islam we
    believe that the women should be treated with the up-most and
    loving respect.

    Explain to me why Islam or the Muslim faith fear our women?
    We treat our Muslim women with respect the same way you
    whites treat your women....there's no differences between the
    two.

    As a Muslim myself...I have NEVER hear of any recent spate
    (as you call it) about Islam or Muslims being in fear of their
    women. What proof is a video in providing real information?
    However, I will say this in closing every culture or religious
    movement requires that the women be treated with respect.
     
  3. Afghan

    Afghan New Member

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    Islamic militants treat their women not as slaves but as 'thing of use'. If a woman show herself as human being, they kill her immediately and call it 'honour'. Recently they killed a female journalist in Kabul and, last night, another in Parwan province of Afghanistan. Islamists want to wrap women in clothes like they wrap Quran. But I think woman is woman not Quran. Why they dont understand it?
     
  4. 9sublime

    9sublime Active Member

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    I think there is a difference between fear and lack of respect. They don't fear their women, thats just a way for the right to make it look even worse. The far right Muslims who do this to their women just have no respect for them.

    You don't fear the food on your plate, do you? But you still have it killed and then eat it.
     
  5. OPGhostdog

    OPGhostdog New Member

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    Afghan, I am not on here to debate your statements or quotes,
    but I am getting the impression concerning two things that's
    questionable. Am I understanding correctly that you're a Muslim?
    Are you over here in America or in Afghanistan?

    Myself I am a member of the Nation of Islam here in America,
    and it seems to me that we have different viewpoints when
    it comes to respecting our Muslim Women. As you mentioned
    in your first sentence.....Islamic militants treat their women not
    as slaves but as 'thing of use'. If a woman show herself as human
    being, they kill her immediately and call it 'honour'.

    So in my closing statement..I do not believe that Islam is in fear
    of the Muslim women. As true worshippers of Islam its our mission
    to teach from the holy quran, and the Islamists has their way of
    thinking just like others do. This internet is a very unique way
    to be anything or be anywhere one wannabe just sitting in his or
    her living room or den.
     
  6. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    Truth - that is an ironic statement. I used to think I knew the truth - then I was gradually awakened by education. Islam is ignorant of the truth, and no matter how long it exists in the westernised world, it will remain ignorant of the truth - that is that allah is nothing but the figmant of Muhammad and his band of brigands.

    To be fair and even handed I feel this way about all organised religions, but Islam in particular makes my blood boil. At least the Momons have the decency to admit to backtracking and alterations - Muslims hide behind 'divine words' & 'revelation' to justify the puritanical clap trap that even the most liberal Mullah espouses.

    Read the Quaran, see that most of it is a very poor immitation of Jewish and Christian history with a dash of Arab folk lore, and then realise that no-one with an educated mind could follow its delusions.

    I make no appologies for the truth, and if it offends then so be it.
     
  7. OPGhostdog

    OPGhostdog New Member

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    I bet I don't and won't hide from no race of people or government.
    I also see that you're hard to accept the truth that no everyone
    is alike. You have something against the Quran?, and who are you
    to judge me or what I believe in? Its people like you who makes my
    blood boiling beyond the breaking point.

    Your education is at the pre-school level as far as I am concerned
    when it comes to you bashing Islam. You read the quran yourself.
    I read the book all throughout the day, and I know the quran plus
    believe in its teaching. Now if you don't like it to bad, and I suggest
    that you stop crying, due to the fact that your crying won't change
    nothing.

    Is Sadistic Savior and you the same person?
     
  8. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    I bash all religious books equally - personaly I feel the bible is trumped up folk lore, the torrah is tribal myths, and the quaran farscical. I am not crying for myself, rather enraged for the 1.2 billion people who have been blinded by the poetic nonsense that Mohammad and his followers have saddled them with.

    I am a historian by training, and one of my skills is the assessment of evidence - and as far as the Quaran goes it is certainly not primary evidence, and very dodgy secondary evidence. I have studied quaranic history in depth, and know that the tenuous links back to Mohammad are stretched thin - it is on par with the bible on that front.

    I am no sadistic saviour - rather a lone voice of rationalism in the sea of the lost.
     
  9. OPGhostdog

    OPGhostdog New Member

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  10. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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  11. OPGhostdog

    OPGhostdog New Member

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    Okay I apologize because I jumped the fence quickly.
    First of all let me say that I work two jobs each day
    4 hours on each job. My morning job is working as a
    Child Protection investigator. My afternoon job is
    a Paralegal (not secretary work) a Human Rights
    Lawyer assistances, and I have a major in the
    Human Rights profession. Thereforth I am one of
    the best in the law firm.

    I am also a dedicated supporter of the Nation of Islam.
    I have been a member of the Muslim community for the
    past 30 years, and everything I post is based on my own
    personal experiences, and not from a book or a newspaper.

    I have traveled to Mecca a few times to worship with
    Muslims of all colors, and I truly believe in Islam.
    Yet there is many Americans who try to violate my rights
    to worship, and especially since 9-11 more confusion has
    been added to the fire.

    Its subjects like this thread's subject that should be well
    researched before posting false information. I have NEVER
    heard of Islam fearing Women, and to me that sounds like
    a bunch of non-senses paragenda.

    So in all due respect just because you're a legal secretary
    means you know the laws of the land or the universal laws.
    However on a message board like this one. A person can
    learn alots just by reading, and respecting one's opinion.

    In closing, I have earned three degrees by studying all
    forms of laws, and whenever a debate presents itself I
    am well prepared to join in. (Also You are no better then
    I am, and I am no better then you are).
     
  12. rejs7

    rejs7 New Member

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    I appreciate your grasp of islam is going to be superior to mine - but it does not get around the fact that the basic tenets of sharia, and therefore islamic, law subjugate women. A woman is worth half a man in court, a quarter of a man in marriage (if the husband has 4 wives), and may be divorced at the whim of her husband.

    Just because you choose to live in a free society does not mean that sharia is any less valid - merely you choose to ignore major sections of it.

    Maybe it is time I clarified the word fear - fear can mean literally afraid, but it can also mean phobia - hense why I called it Matraphobia (it should correctly be called Gynophobia). The jist of the argument is that men are men the world over, and anything that femminises them is seen as weak and degenerate. They fear the femmine as weak, and see women as property and son bearers - maybe modern sensibility has changed this, but it is still true in the quaran.
     
  13. invest07

    invest07 Member

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    GhostDog
    What planet are you from? I guess you think we are infidels and are following the words of "The Prophet" when he says it's ok to lie to infidels.
    So women are respected under Islam. Really. That is what you would have us believe? Here are a few excerpts from the word of "The Prophet". Mohammed - "A True Saint"
    Lets start with quotes from the "heavenly" Hadiths and the "ocean of knowledge", Koran.
    (Al-Hadis, Vol. 3, p. 137) Abu Sayeed al-Khodri reported that Mohammed was talking to a group of women when he said, "... I see the majority of you will go to Hell." The women asked why, to which Mohammed responded, "You often curse and are ungrateful to your companions." He then told them they had a basic defect in their nature, to which they responded, "How?" Mohammed answered, "Is not the attestation (knowledge and witness) of a women only worth half of a man's? And that is on account of her short intelligence."

    This quote really brings out Mohammed's "shining" views on women. He automatically condemns the majority of them to hell. According to him a woman's intellectual capacity is only half that of a man and that is why two women are required as witnesses as compared to one man.
    He was so scared of women's intelligence that he said, "a man should not walk between two women" (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 586) as that would mean that the man was taking a risk of being on equal turf according to Mohammed.
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 692) Ibn Ma`sud reported from the Messenger of Allah who said, "A woman is like a private part (sex organ). When she goes out (walking) the devil casts a glance at her (in lust)."
    Well, this clearly gives us an insight into Mohammed's "pure" mind. To him women were nothing but walking vaginas to be used as objects for sexual fulfillment. No wonder he required women to be completely covered from head to toe. He had to have some way to control his lust!
    (Koran, 4:34) ...Guard in (the husband's)absence what Allah would have them guard...

    This verse is demanding that the women should guard their private parts for the sake of their husbands. Again, this tells us the low opinion that Mohammed held for women-- objects to be used for sexual fulfillment. Nowhere in the Koran or the Hadiths does it say that a man should guard his private parts or abstain from sex in the absence of their wives. A man can even engage in sexual intercourse with young boys/men without much rebuke from Allah. This is supported by the verses stated below:
    (Koran 4:15) If two men among you commit indecency (sodomy) punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, let them be. Allah is forgiving and merciful.

    (Koran 4:16) If any one of your women is guilty of lewdness ...confine them until death claims them.

    As you can see, for women any sort of sexual exploration is punishable by death. Whereas for a man, any form of perversion is pardoned by the all merciful Allah. Such fairness can only be found in the "holiest of the holiest books", the Koran.
    (Koran 4:34) ...As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them, refuse to share their beds and BEAT THEM...
    Mohammed was an old perverted nutcase. He was so insecure about himself that he thought that showing physical prowess over women would serve as a reminder to him of his manliness. Thus, he encouraged wife beating! In Islam equality between a man and a woman is a far cry. A man needs only to be suspicious to justify the bestial act of beating his wife.
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 215) Omar reported from the Holy Prophet who said, "No man shall be questioned for beating his wife."

    In the very next Hadith a woman complained to Mohammed that her husband beat her while she prayed. Mohammed told her to change her time of prayer or pray shorter prayers so that her husband could get on with the joy of beating her. (Reported by Abu Sayeed al-Kodri, Attest by Abu Daud)
    Could Mohammed degrade women any further? If you are asking yourself this question then surprisingly you have not yet grasped the true nature of this "great Prophet" . He allowed the utterly inhuman practice of circumcision for females. In this type of circumcision a girl's clitoris is carved away, so that she may never experience climax during sexual intercourse and her vulva is sewn shut until it is cut open at the time of marriage! Such "great" practices can only be sactioned by Islam-- the religion for all women to embrace!

    (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 738) Abul Malih reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "Circumcision is Sunnat (required by Islamic law) for males and optional for females."

    OK, enough of looking at the negative side of Islam. Now lets look at the positive side of this religion. Mohammed said that a man before marrying a woman has to pay her a dowry. Surely, as the many devout muslims would say, you can't criticize that. Ah, but they are mistaken, then again, that's not anything new. Read the quote below from Al Hadis.

    (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 657) Oqbah-b- A`mer reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "The most equitable of the conditions of marriage is that you should fulfil that (dowry) with which you have made private parts lawful."

    So, according to Mohammed and his Allah a man has to pay the woman before he can use her private parts. Which means that the man is supposed to treat his wife as a prostitute by paying her before he gets a legal permit for having sex. This implies that the foundation for marriage in Islam is to provide a man with legal sexual gratification and nothing else matters.
    Now, hold on! Doesn't Islam say that prostitution is not allowed? Of course, it does! It's right there in Sahih Muslim Hadith:
    (Sahih Muslim Hadith Chapter 619) Selling a cat, selling a dog (unless it is a working dog), and earning of prostitutes(unless they are non-muslims),... are all forbidden.

    Here we have a contradiction! But, again, that is nothing new for the Koran. It is full of contradictions. But I digress, a separate article will be devoted to this in the coming weeks.
    Back to the dowry issue. Mohammed was not a man who would have people speculate on what he has said. He had to specify what he meant by dowry and specify he did in Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 659 (57). He said that, "a handful of barley or dates is enough."

    Not only are the wives supposed to be treated as prostitutes, but as prostitutes who only deserve "a handful of barley or dates".
    Another quote from the Hadith gives total control of women's lives to men.
    (Al Hadis, Vol 2, p. 651) Abu Hurairah reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "No woman shall give a woman in marriage, nor shall a woman give herself in marriage. Verily, the fornicatress is she that marries by herself."

    Here Mohammed takes away the right of a woman to choose her husband. She has no right to decide how to live her life. This basic right is snatched away from her and given to a man. Furthermore, this implies that a widow has no final authority over her daughter in Islam.
    As if men didn't already have the legal freedom to control and degrade women's lives that they were granted further control to degrade women.
    During a Jihad expedition (holy war) Mohammed's men came to him very frustrated. As seen in the quote below:
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 686) Ibn Masud reported, "We were fighting with the Messenger of Allah, and our wives were not with us. We asked the Messenger of Allah, 'Should we castrate ourselves?' The Holy Prophet forbade us from that, and then he allowed us Muta (temporary) marriage. So, we all married wives for a fixed time (usually three days) for the dowry of a piece of cloth."

    Here Mohammed clearly tells the muslims to forget about the prostitutes they had purchased for a handful of dates back home and to have fun with these new victims who come even cheaper. They can be bought and violated for only a piece of cloth. Allah is truly merciful! Praise be to Allah!
    In other civilized countries this is called rape--plain and simple. The mullahs happily approve this dastardly deed by quoting from the Koran. (Koran, 5:87): "...Make not unlawful the good things Allah hath made lawful for you." Thus this heinous crime is still committed by muslims as attested by the Indo-Pak war, Arab-Israeli war, Iraq- Iran war, Iraq-Kuwait war, etc.
    Sometimes Mohammed's lust was so great that he conveniently forgot all the Koranic verses invented by him and did not have time to come up with an ammendment. One instance of this is noted when he married Safiya, a Jewish girl, after killing her father and her betrothed husband. He did not want to go through the long laborious procedure of finding a sponsor, paying the dowry, sending out invitations, or preparing a wedding feast. In fact, Mohammed skipped over the usual law of waiting until her next monthly was passed. He consummated his "marriage" to her on a sand dune with the blood and gore of Jihad still covering him, even Safiya's father's blood, no doubt. This is another case of rape, but for Mohammed it was just a beautiful marriage sanctioned by the All Perverted Allah!
    It is sickening to read the Koran and the Hadiths and the low and inhuman opinion that this so called despicable Mohammed has on women.
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 2. p. 638) Abdur Rahman- b-Salem reported that the Apostle of Allah said, "You should marry virgins, and verily they are sweeter in tongue, more prolific in wombs, and easily satisfied with little."
    I don't think I need to explain the quote above. It is quite clear. The list of legalized inhuman acts continues on. For example, a man has a right to divorce his wife by uttering the word, "Talaq" only three times, whereas a woman has no such right, a man can have upto four wives. No such "privilege" exists for a woman in Islam. A man may practise sodomy and in fact, it is even encouraged as it is legal in the muslim Paradise. But any sort of lewdness for women is punishable by death.
     
  14. invest07

    invest07 Member

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    GhostDog, continued
    Some would now think that there is absolutely no hope for women in Islam. How dare you let such a thought enter your filthy mind! May you be roasted in hellfire for thinking this way. Actually, the "all merciful" Allah did tell Mohammed that a woman can enter paradise! How, you may ask? Well, it's quite simple. All she has to do is please her husband--answer to his mating call wherever or whenever he wants and Bingo!, she's got a free one-way ticket to paradise! See how easy it is. She doesn't have to be intelligent, she doesn't have to have a good personality and she need not perform any good deeds. All she has to do is obey and please her husband. That's it! She gets to go to paradise and watch her husband make out with the 72 Houris and 28 young boys-- every woman's dream come true. Is it any wonder that Mohammed's wives fought over him every night? Again, I have listed the quotes below which support my point.
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 211 (60)) Omme Salmah reported that the messenger of Allah said, "Any female (wife or concubine) who dies while her husband was pleased with her will enter Paradise."

    This is clarified in the very next Hadith.
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p.211 (61)) Tal qe-b-Ali reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "When a man calls his wife to satisfy his desire, let her come to him though she is occupied at the oven."

    (Al Hadis, Vol. 4, p. 172, No. 34) Ali reported that the Apostle of Allah said, "There is in Paradise a market wherein there will be no buying or selling, but will consist of men and women. When a man desires a beauty, he will have intercourse with them."
    Notice that all the privileges are granted to men and even though women may enter paradise they do not get 72 male sex bombs and 28 young girls. Shouldn't it be the same for them as well?
    One can imagine how Muslims must treat women of other faiths if they treat Muslim women in such a degrading manner. One should not accept much from a religion which dictates how one should piss, fart, and ****!
    (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 682-683, No. 106) Ayesha reported that the Prophet of Allah enquired as he was dying, "Where shall I pass tomorrow, where shall I pass tomorrow?" He was hoping it would be me (Ayesha), so his other wives gave him permission to use their turns so he could be with me (Ayesha) until he died.

    Picture this, here is a "saintly" old man dying in the arms of his seventeen year old child bride and still fantasizing about which one of his wives to have sex with the next day. How truly divine the Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) was!!

    This is a quote from a writer on an unnamed web site. Sorry I can't give you the source as you would probably put a price on the author's head.
     
  15. Blue

    Blue New Member

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    Violance and cruelty are inside of the human. This is not about religion. As a Muslim girl , I can easily say that Islam is a religion against violance. To Islam you mustn't harm/damage/attack anybody. This is big sin.

    These kind of cruelties are not related with any religion. This is about being a bad person, cruel person.

    Don't you see violance to women, cruelty to women in the world? Are all of them Muslim? The matter is the violance against to women , the matter is not religion.


    (ps: My english is intermediate. So if I've made some mistakes, so sorry)
     
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