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Stem cells nurture damaged spine: study

Discussion in 'Health' started by DemandCurve, Jan 18, 2007.

  1. DemandCurve

    DemandCurve New Member

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    nerves in rats, producing compounds that nurture nerve cells and stimulate the growth of new ones, Geron Corp. said on Wednesday.

    Read more here
     
  2. palerider

    palerider Well-Known Member

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    And to do this in rats, they killed how many living human beings? Meanwhile, scientists using adult stem cells have actually restored feeling and movement in a patient who suffered a spinal injury 19 years ago.

    http://journalsonline.tandf.co.uk/content/q77706775451qh1l/?p=854daac8a08549d28dcf079489f24417&pi=7

    And they didn't have to kill a single innocent human being to do it. The future of stem cell therapy lies in adult stem cells, not embryonic stem cells. Embryonic research is just a front for the pro choice movement as if killing one human being in an effort to offer a cure to another were a legitimate field of science.

    Here is a partial list of ailments that have been successfully treated with adult stem cells.

    Brain Cancer - Retinoblastoma -Ovarian Cancer - Merkel Cell Carcinoma -Testicular Cancer -
    Non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma -Hodgkin’s Lymphoma - Acute Lymphoblastic Leukemia -Acute Myelogenous Leukemia -Chronic Myelogenous Leukemia - Juvenile Myelomonocytic Leukemia
    Chronic Myelomonocytic Leukemia - Angioimmunoblastic Lymphadenopathy -Multiple Myeloma -
    Myelodysplasia -Breast Cancer -Neuroblastoma -Renal Cell Carcinoma -Various Solid Tumors -Soft Tissue Sarcoma -Ewing’s Sarcoma -Waldenstrom’s macroglobulinemia -Hemophagocytic lymphohistiocytosis -POEMS syndrome -Myelofibrosis -Systemic Lupus -Sjogren’s Syndrome -Myasthenia -Autoimmune Cytopenia -Scleromyxedema -Scleroderma -Crohn’s Disease -Behcet’s Disease -Rheumatoid Arthritis -Juvenile Arthritis -Multiple Sclerosis -Polychondritis -Systemic Vasculitis -Alopecia Universalis -Buerger’s Disease -Acute Heart Damage -Chronic Coronary Artery Disease -Corneal regeneration -Severe Combined Immunodeficiency Syndrome -X-linked Lymphoproliferative Syndrome -X-linked Hyper immunoglobulin M Syndrome -Parkinson’s Disease -Spinal Cord Injury -Stroke Damage -Sickle Cell Anemia -Sideroblastic Anemia -Aplastic Anemia -
    Red Cell Aplasia Amegakaryocytic Thrombocytopenia -Thalassemia -Primary Amyloidosis -Diamond Blackfan Anemia -Fanconi’s Anemia -Chronic Epstein-Barr Infection -Limb Gangrene -Surface Wound Healing -Jawbone Replacement -Skull Bone Repair -Hurler’s Syndrome -Osteogenesis Imperfecta -Krabbe Leukodystrophy -Osteopetrosis -Cerebral X-Linked Adrenoleukodystrophy -Chronic Liver Failure -Liver Cirrhosis -End-Stage Bladder Disease .

    To be completely fair, here is the complete list of treatments that have resulted from embryonic stem cell research.



    Yep. That is the entire list.
     
  3. Friendindeed

    Friendindeed New Member

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    Parkinsons ? Did someone forget to tell Michael J. Fox about that ?
     
  4. palerider

    palerider Well-Known Member

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    There have been no effective treatments for parkinsons or alzheimer's with embryonic stem cells. If he is under the impression that effective treatement has come out of embryonic stem cell research, or is likely to, he has been misinformed.

    Treatment after treatment works, and is approved with adult, and cord blood stem cells but no effective treatment for anything has been developed with embryonic stem cells. Embryonic stem cell research is a front by the pro choice movement in an attempt to soften society's ever hardening opinion of abortion.

    Little mention is ever made of the successes (albeit limited) that have occurred in reversing the symptoms of parkinson's using patient's own stem cells. Symptoms have been dramatically reduced and even halted for periods as long as 4 years.

    The press simply has little respect for cures that derive from adult stem cells but will fill newsprint colums with drivel about this effect or that effect in rats with embryonic stem cells.
     
  5. Friendindeed

    Friendindeed New Member

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    Could you show me where to find something about the reversing or halting of Parkinsons with adult stem cells ?
     
  6. palerider

    palerider Well-Known Member

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    Not a problem:

    Follow the links on the left hand side of the page.

    http://www.cellmedicine.com/

    http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-smith042302.asp

    http://www.leaderu.com/science/stemcelltestimony_turner.html

    http://www.cbhd.org/resources/stemcells/mcconchie_2004-06-16.htm

    There are more but this should be enough to get you started. I spend a fair amount of time researching this subject. I have a condition in which my best hope for a cure lies in a stem cell transplant. I have been watching this field for years and have been steadily encouraged by the advances made with adult stem cells. Early on, I decided that I would not accept any treatment derived from embryonic stem cells and watched the progress of the research closely.

    My condition is among those that is treatable using my own, or my brother's (a perfect match) stem cells when the time comes to pursue more aggressive treatment. To date, not a single therapy has been derived from embryonic stem cells. Some work has been done in mice that has yielded minimal success, but such research is possibly decades away from use in human beings while the list for successful treatment using adult stem cells grows by 4 or 5 serious diseases per year.

    There are some inherent biological problems inherent in using embryonic stem cells that I genuinely don't believe science is ever going to be able to overcome. If embryonic stem cell research were being done with any other material, history suggests that the long list of failures would have resulted in funding drying up some time ago and the research abandoned due to insurmountable obstacles. The pro choice movement has very deep pockets, and considerable political power and as a result, they will fund this until even the scientists doing the research become disgusted and abandon it.
     
  7. Friendindeed

    Friendindeed New Member

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    Thanks, I'll look at all of it.
    I have heard that ESCs have caused tumors.
     
  8. palerider

    palerider Well-Known Member

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    Tumors are some of the least bizzare things they have caused. One parkinson's patient died because the embryonic stem cells began to form bone in his brain.
     
  9. Fonz

    Fonz New Member

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    what?
     
  10. palerider

    palerider Well-Known Member

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    An embryo is exactly as human as you.
     
  11. vyo476

    vyo476 Active Member

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    This is far from my area of expertise, but it appears to me as though the main difference between adult and embryonic stem cells is that adult stem cells are undifferentiated whereas embryonic stem cells are pluripotent. In other words, adult stem cells are designed to repair just about any part of the body, whereas embryonic stem cells are designed to grow into any part of the body. I can see where research into both derivatives could yield promising results.
     
  12. Fonz

    Fonz New Member

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    Nearly every cell in your entire body is a potential human being, given our recent advances in genetic engineering.

    Do you also weep everytime you scratch your nose and committ a literal holocaust of human beings?

    Did you know that Embryos sometimes split? Is that a case of one human being becoming two? Sometimes Two embryos fuse into one, creating a Chimera. What happens to that extra human being in this case?

    This naive idea you have is both intellectually and morally wrong.
     
  13. vyo476

    vyo476 Active Member

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    Interesting. I've never thought of it this way.

    When is a human being a human being then? Birth? A specific trimester of the pregnancy? I'm curious to hear you're stance on this because I've been on the fence about things like abortion for a long time and I think you might have something here that'll allow me to put the issue to rest.
     
  14. Fonz

    Fonz New Member

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    Thats a tough question and not easily answerable. it all comes down to when the Fetus develops a consciousness and can sense pain or discomfort.

    Theres no straightforward answer, though I think we can probably agree that a consciousness doesn't develop until at least certain organs are developed. Like the brain stem for instance.

    Of course we could probably argue all night over what constitutes a consciousness. I've read study's by some scientists claiming that a baby doesn't even develop a sense of awareness or consciousness until around age 1. I don't personally agree with this however.

    I am personally a vegetarian, and feel that we have ethical and moral responsibilities towards every life, whether its an animal or human being.

    I'm not for abortion, but I would never want to take away a womans right to choose what she does with her body, especially when the scientific debate is still raging over what constitutes a life.

    One thing for certain, is that when people have their sense of morals blinded by religious dogma, and not grounded in clear biological science, things like the abortion debate and Stem Cell debate, get real clouded in nonsense.

    To get back on topic, and to further explain my point here.

    A three day old human embryo is a collection of 150 cells called a blastocyst. There are for the sake of comparison, more than 100,000 cells in the brain of a fly. The human embryos that are destroyed in stem cell research do not have brains, or even neutrons. Consequently there is no reason to beileve that they can suffer in any way at all. Furthermore, its worth remembering, that when a persons brain has died, its currently morally acceptable to harvest the human beings organs, to save another persons life. If it is acceptable to treat a person whos brain has died as something less than a human being, it should also be acceptable to treat a blastocyst as such as well. And if someone is really concerned about the suffering in this universe, killing a fly should present that person with greater moral difficulties than killing a human blastocyst. And from what I understand, PaleRider hunts and kill defenseless Turkeys....
     
  15. Dave

    Dave New Member

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    I don't really think that anyone here is qualified to make a medical opinion of what a human being is, but if you want a philosophical opinion, then one could make the case for any trimester you want. Just a few facts to consider:

    At 6 weeks the embryo is about 1/5 of an inch in length. A primitive heart is beating. Head, mouth, liver, and intestines begin to take shape.

    At 10 weeks the embryo is now about 1 inch in length. Facial features, limbs, hands, feet, fingers, and toes become apparent. The nervous system is responsive and many of the internal organs begin to function.

    At 14 weeks the fetus is now 3 inches long and weighs almost an ounce. The muscles begin to develop and sex organs form. Eyelids, fingernails, and toenails also form. The child’s spontaneous movements can be observed.

    At 18 weeks the fetus is now about 5 inches long. The child blinks, grasps, and moves her mouth. Hair grows on the head and body.

    At 22 weeks the fetus now weighs approximately 1/2 a pound and spans about 10 inches from head to toe. Sweat glands develop, and the external skin has turned from transparent to opaque.

    At 26 weeks the fetus can now inhale, exhale and even cry. Eyes have completely formed, and the tongue has developed taste buds. Under intensive medical care the fetus has over a 50% chance of surviving outside the womb.

    At 30 weeks the fetus is usually capable of living outside the womb and would be considered premature at birth.

    At 40 weeks the child is now ready to live outside of his mother’s womb.


    In my non-professional opinion, I can't really see how someone can say that a fetus is any different from any baby once it reaches the third trimester. The second trimester and even late into the first trimester seems to be extremely dangerous territory to me. The fetus has every appearance of a human child with the exception of size, and I'm not sure that can be a very reliable determining factor. I would not be comfortable with any abortion procedure after about 8 weeks.
     
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