yea! socialized medicine

[Unite Our Nation]

And you haven't lived here under our GREAT Nation and its healthcare, so stop throwing **** because you don't know what you are talking about!

I've traveled the world and had healthcare in many places. Have close friends who are docs that travel the world and KNOW that our health care in the States is the best.

We can improve it, AND WE WILL.

We don't need those from nations with FAILED AND FAILING healthcare systems to give us their oh so wise advice. Pleeease...

 

[9sublime]

Its the best healthcare for those who can afford it. Thats the problem with your healthcare.

 

[Andy]

It screws up EVERY time? Stop talking rubbish. First of all, you don't live in a country with socialised healthcare, and so you've never had to use it. I do, and I've use it successfully many, many times.

By all means, name the system, and we'll see. Which country would you contend has great socialized care?

Andy...there is just soooooo much wrong in your post (no. 13) that its pretty well pointless going into it needless to say many thanks for your contribution

Feel free to prove me wrong! I want to see facts and figures. Like how much is it costing each citizen? Like how long do people wait? How many have died waiting? How many have gone to a different country to get health care? Because I have some pretty interesting statistics on each of those, and they don't look good.

Its the best healthcare for those who can afford it. Thats the problem with your healthcare.

Yeah, and in nearly every socialized health system I've seen, it either does suck for everyone, or is getting there.

When people have to pay 40% taxes to get health care that we pay a fraction of that for, I don't see this as being a plus.

When other systems are bankrupt and they are cutting services in order to reduce costs, I don't see that as a plus. When people are flying from the UK to India to get treatment, when their home countries health care is supposed to be "free" I don't see that as a plus.

When there is a COMPANY in Canada that SPECIALIZES in getting people OUT OF THE COUNTRY, to get health care.... THIS IS NOT A PLUS!

So name the system! Let's see if it's as good as you claim!

 

[9sublime]

The NHS gives top quality healthcare to thousands of people every day. Of course you get scare stories and bad news about it, because its not perfect.

Conservatives seem to believe that the government should only pay for police and fire to protect its people. How is it logical to refuse them the most vital protection, that of their health?

 

[Unite Our Nation]

The reason government needs to stay out of healthcare is because they would have to add so much to the top by governing it, that you've already lost anything you could gain! Government CAN NEVER do anything better or cheaper than private sector.

Give me one example of where they ever have!

Just the process itself is the problem.

Our healthcare NEEDS revamped. It needs to take the best of what we have and package it so it is cheaper and more available to all.

Keep in mind folks that the LARGE MAJORITY of Americans who do not have healtcare don't simply because THEY CHOOSE NOT TO. Studies have been done over and over that show the majority of uninsured are young and prefer to spend their $ on other things, such as partying, rather than to healthcare.

They CAN afford healthcare...they make the choice not to pay for it! That's their choice.

Now politicians are trying to MAKE THEM SPEND THEIR MONEY on something they would prefer not to??? That's screwed up!

 

[Mr. Shaman]

But now Australia has rejected Dr. Bernhard Moeller's application for residency, saying Lukas does not meet the "health requirement" and would pose a burden on taxpayers for his medical care, education and other services.

I guess everyone's got their (own) version of Pre-Existing Conditions.

Heyyyyyyy....it's nothin' personal. It's only bu$ine$$.

 

[bododie]

I guess everyone's got their (own) version of Pre-Existing Conditions

Now if only we could get rid of all the products of crackhead moms here it would be a much better country. Nothing personal. Good business.

Do you agree?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Now if only we could get rid of all the products of crackhead moms here it would be a much better country.

Ah, yes.....the Nationalist-Option.

 

[bododie]

What's wrong, hit too close to home?

 

[9sublime]

By the same argument Unite our nation, the private sector could fight fires better. Why don't we privatise that? How about the police force too?

 

[Andy]

By the same argument Unite our nation, the private sector could fight fires better. Why don't we privatise that? How about the police force too?

Typically because fire & police departments are universally paid for by the lowest levels of government, the city for example, the problems are generally not like those found by a federal governmental system. This is why the Constitutional specifically states the purpose of the federal government, and all other rights are reserved for the state. Meaning, anything not specifically stated a federal duty, is reserved for the states.

See, the lower on the governmental totem pole you get, the more control the people have over the situation. If a fire department is wasteful and inefficient, while being incompetent at putting out fires, the local public will scream.

On the federal level, people can be manipulated by the mass media and convinced a failing system works. Like socialized MassHealth which is failing horribly, yet on the national level people want it. Yet if you ask the local population, reviews are far less flattering.

But as far as privatizing such things, I'll just give a related example. Private Security Contractors, or PMCs as they were called in Iraq, are an example of privatized military services. Our troops in Iraq constantly complained that the PMCs were better equipped, had better weapons, had better armor, and many times had better vehicles and support, and to top it off, were paid more.

PMCs

By the way, I am not for the privatization of the military in general. It is the one primary duty of the federal government. I'm just showing this as an example of how capitalism always trumps socialism.

 

[Andy]

Ah, yes.....the Nationalist-Option.

This is pretty much what you support. You just do it indirection by socializing our health care into rationing and horribly quality, and people will die while waiting for their free care.

 

[Lagboltz]

Typically because fire & police departments are universally paid for by the lowest levels of government, the city for example, the problems are generally not like those found by a federal governmental system. This is why the Constitutional specifically states the purpose of the federal government, and all other rights are reserved for the state. Meaning, anything not specifically stated a federal duty, is reserved for the states.

See, the lower on the governmental totem pole you get, the more control the people have over the situation. If a fire department is wasteful and inefficient, while being incompetent at putting out fires, the local public will scream.

Good answer

But as far as privatizing such things, I'll just give a related example. Private Security Contractors, or PMCs as they were called in Iraq, are an example of privatized military services. Our troops in Iraq constantly complained that the PMCs were better equipped, had better weapons, had better armor, and many times had better vehicles and support, and to top it off, were paid more.

A good example of privatization, but we taxpayers got a very big bill for that, and there were documented cases of overcharging.

 

[Andy]

Good answer

A good example of privatization, but we taxpayers got a very big bill for that, and there were documented cases of overcharging.

Yeah, the only other examples of government giving taxpayers a very big bill and over charging would be.... Medicare, US Postal Service, Social Security, Department of Agricuture, The State Department, NASA, The Judicial Branch, VA Department, The FDA, The FCC, National Institute of Health, HUD Department, The Legislative Branch, Department of Homeland Security, Corp of Public Broadcasting, Office of Government Ethics, Department of the Interior, Medicaid, Department of Energy, Department of Education, Department of Transportation, The Executive Branch, Core of Engineers, Department of Commerce, The EPA, The NEA, and of course the Defense Department....

...but yes, the CMPs clearly over charged some, and tax payers paid it.

(I love how I said "indirection" instead of "indirectly" in my Shaman response. Serves me right for not proof reading because it was a short response. lol)

 

[9sublime]

So Unite our nation, would you be opposed to states taxing people in order to pay for a socialised healthcare system confined to that state alone?