Are all believers in God automatically idol worshipers?

Gnostic Christian Bishop

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Are all believers in God automatically idol worshipers?

All believers in God are following an entity that they only know by what other people have said about that God. Few, if any, know their God from apotheosis or first-hand information.

That fact makes whoever that God is, an idol.

It must be so, as what is believed is not a known or real entity. Believers have no real or personal knowledge or experience of their God. All a believer can have is faith in whichever God they are idolizing based on what others have said.

Do you, as a believer, recognize that you are an idol worshiper?

Regards
DL
 
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From what Iv'e always been taught in traditonal Christianity, idolatry would be the worship of something other than the Hebrew God. However, we have to define what worship consists of. For one thing, it would be something that would draw devotion away from Jehovah, as he is a jealous God as stated in Exodus. For instance, your employment can be a distraction from God, so can hobbies, and even your wife or children. For instance, one time God demanded a child sacrifice, which he later stopped to allow one person to prove his loyality.

Note, all references to God in the above paragraph would be referring to Jehovah.
 
From what Iv'e always been taught in traditonal Christianity, idolatry would be the worship of something other than the Hebrew God. However, we have to define what worship consists of. For one thing, it would be something that would draw devotion away from Jehovah, as he is a jealous God as stated in Exodus. For instance, your employment can be a distraction from God, so can hobbies, and even your wife or children. For instance, one time God demanded a child sacrifice, which he later stopped to allow one person to prove his loyality.

Note, all references to God in the above paragraph would be referring to Jehovah.

Any God who is an infanticidal prick is not worthy of that title. This aside.

Thanks for the reply.

Are all believers in God automatically idol worshipers?

Regards
DL
 
From what Iv'e always been taught in traditonal Christianity, idolatry would be the worship of something other than the Hebrew God.
And "something other" could be a stick, an image, an idea, or a distorted and inaccurate or essentially intellectual concept of what the scriptures mean as a "Hebrew God" and that is where Christianity is today and what G.C. said, above.


However, we have to define what worship consists of. For one thing, it would be something that would draw devotion away from Jehovah, as he is a jealous God as stated in Exodus.
So (your words and construct): "worship consists of . . . something that would draw devotion away from Jehovah"? Want to try again?

For instance, your employment can be a distraction from God, so can hobbies, and even your wife or children. For instance, one time God demanded a child sacrifice, which he later stopped to allow one person to prove his loyality (sic).
...according to the story. But I think you entirely missed G.C.'s point, which is (if I may paraphrase) that when we read the bible, study the bible, attend bible study classes, listen to recordings of our favorite preacher/pastor/ideologue ranting about "God", cross-reference the original Greek with the English translation, etc etc etc, we are only, and I stress "only" acquiring an intellectual picture of the subject and "God" in particular. Not a spiritual one. Not one based in a direct, immediate experience of God. And when the intellect tries to grasp this particular subject, the intellect invariable and inescapably fits it into one's experience in the world of ego. And that necessarily means a distortion. And that distortion is the idol to which G.C. refers.

But when a devotee actually and correctly follows the bible and practices what the bible (N.T. in particular) teaches one should do as a correct practice, it produces eventually the direct, immediate experience of God. And the result is not an idol, and it is only then that no idol is created. And this experience opens up a whole new, spiritual meaning to passages of scripture and the meaning in the bible of discussions of idols takes on a whole new light as well. It is then seen spiritually and correctly.

Modern Christianity lost this practice long, long ago and what is practices today is an idol. In fact, today's Christians are unwittingly obeying a Catholic Church edict handed down and begun in the 16th and 17th centuries, and that is the original cause and time of the change to pursuit of an intellectual understanding of the bible.
 
http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-worship-statues

Actually, the Catholics have a good comeback to the charge of idolatry. The above article cites some places in the Bible where the Israelites used, but didn't worship various images and statues. In other words, the images and statues made them think of God. They didn't worship the lifeless objects themselves.
 
http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-worship-statues

Actually, the Catholics have a good comeback to the charge of idolatry. The above article cites some places in the Bible where the Israelites used, but didn't worship various images and statues. In other words, the images and statues made them think of God. They didn't worship the lifeless objects themselves.

Understood but your "made them think of God", shows them as idol worshipers or the concept or construct that they created in their minds.

Have a look at this definition and see if you agree that a concept is and idol.


From the Oxford Concise Dictionary of World Religions (2000 Oxford U. Press) p. 266

"Idolatry (Gk eidolon image + latreia worship.) The attributing of absolute value to that which is not absolute, and acting toward that object, person or concept as though it is worthy of worship or complete commitment. In a religious context this most usually mean treating as God that which is not God, and in particular acting toward a representation of God as if it is God. Thus idolatry is associated with the worship of idols, as though these are the actuality of God. In that sense, idolatry is extremely rare, since most religious worshippers are well aware that the signpost is not be be confused with that which is signified." [Discussion of the attitude to idolatry in Judaism and Islam follows.]

Regards
DL
 
Wow. You entirely missed what I said too.

He is fixated on statues while ignoring the full definition of idol worship which includes mental pictures and concepts.

Even words can be idolized as shown when people use the term WORD OF GOD for the bible. They idolize the words because they thing God said them.

Regards
DL
 
Basically, the word idol means false god. Therefore, according to the Hebrew God, all gods apart from him are false, and therefore idols. According to athiests and pagans perhaps the Hebrew God would be an idol simply cause they don't think he is the true God.
 
Basically, the word idol means false god. Therefore, according to the Hebrew God, all gods apart from him are false, and therefore idols. According to athiests and pagans perhaps the Hebrew God would be an idol simply cause they don't think he is the true God.

Every theist will think those of other religions are idol worshipers while saying his god is the only real one.

Theism is a mental disorder.

If one man claims to know a god, he is called insane or delusional. When many make the same claim, they call it a religion.

Intelligent people will see religions as collectives of insane or delusional people.

Regards
DL
 
Jason, I really believe you are trying hard to NOT understand what has been said.

Basically, the word idol means false god. Therefore, according to the Hebrew God, all gods apart from him are false, and therefore idols.
Thousands of years ago some civilizations carved a figure of wood or painted a figure on rocks and agreed it was a god, and worshipped it. They looked for signs attributed to it indicating when to plant and when to harvest; when to marry and when to celebrate natural events. They looked to it for guidance in their lives. So idol worship is also about images, carved figures, and even closely held ideas. Think deeply about Romans 1:20-23 "For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things." It is also covering the issue of ideas. Do you understand that money can be an idol for some?

Note in that passage "changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image". That image can be an idea or concept.

People have an idea of who/what "god" is and that is an idol. Anything you hold in your mind representing god is not god . . . --it is an idol. Only the direct, immediate experience of God is not an idol. Everything else you hold in mind and they are all idols because they are not the "real thing".
 
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People have an idea of who/what "god" is and that is an idol. Anything you hold in your mind representing god is not god . . . --it is an idol. Only the direct, immediate experience of God is not an idol. Everything else you hold in mind and they are all idols because they are not the "real thing".

I like the poetic way this guy defines god but then he shows himself to be an idol worshiper himself.


Regards
DL
 
People read those Romans verses with preconceived notions already in their minds about those verses and what they are saying. When you read the word "image" they assume a carved or painted idol. But notice that nowhere in those verses does it mention the word "idol". And notice it says specifically "became vain in their imaginations" and that is a direct reference to ideas and concepts. But if we can thoroughly eliminate all preconceived notions from mind and approach those verses with a blank slate (not so easy to do) we will see that it is about everything we see and our belief that it is what we see and believe it to be, whether a tree, a frog, a bird, or a river. We see them as our ideas of them. And we will see that these verses are not about religious carvings or paintings.

So, do you have thoughts about who/what god is? That is an idol because it is not the "real thing". Only the direct, immediate experience of god is "the real thing . . . and nothing else is.
 
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