Enabling churches for social welfare work

flaja

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Part I

In another thread I suggested that we should find ways to empower the private sector, especially churches, to deal with healthcare and other social welfare issues. I started that thread in preparation for a discussion of a constitutional amendment that would enable America’s churches to take a more active role in society without facing government interference.

I do not wish to have either the Constitution or statutory law define religion; determine what doctrine is for any religion, or make any commentary on the interrelationship between the adherents of any other religion or between them and whatever they accept as holy. I am using the term church only because in American popular culture church-state relations are synonymous with the relationship between government and religion regardless of what the religion is.

I do not expect any church or religious organization to do all of the things that this amendment would let them do, but I do want church congregations to have the power to the things listed in this amendment without having to face constant court fights. The more vague the Constitution is, the more chance there will be for litigation.

Material in italics is meant for explanatory purposes and is not part of the amendment.

Church Enabling Amendment

Section 1: The ability to freely exercise religion without the undue interference of the state being necessary for the preservation of their constitutional rights and liberties, the American People retain the right to establish churches in accordance with this amendment reserving unto the Congress and the several states the power to regulate and tax churches that may be otherwise established.

Section 2: The Congress shall upon the application of not less than one hundred incorporators and without regard to doctrine or other qualifications, issue a charter for any organization hereby established as a church for the purpose of this amendment, and such charter shall set forth the bylaws and doctrine of the church and the qualifications necessary for the employees, members, clergy, trustees and officers thereof providing that no church may deny membership to any person on account of race or national origin or failure to provide monetary contributions to the church or any employee, member, clergy, trustee or officer thereof.

Section 3: Each church established in accordance with this amendment shall designate not less than fifty persons to serve as trustees for the church as determined by the bylaws of the church and no more than one-half of the total number of trustees shall also be an incorporator, clergy or officer of the church.
Each church established in accordance with this amendment shall designate as the bylaws of the church may direct persons to serve as corporate officers, but no more than one-half of such officers may also be a trustee of the church and no more than one-half of such officers may also be an incorporator of the church.

Section 4: Any church established in accordance with this amendment shall retain the right to worship, to proselytize and to provide for the social welfare of the American People and thereby shall have the power to:
(01) Establish and maintain orphanages and provide adoption services under the regulations which the separate states may devise by law;
(02) Provide disability, retirement, unemployment, workers’ compensation and survivors’ pensions as the bylaws of the church may direct and under such regulations as its trustees may devise;
(03) Insure real and chattel property against loss and damage as the bylaws of the church may direct and under such regulations as its trustees may devise;
(04) Establish and maintain hospitals, pharmacies and other medical facilities under the regulations which the Congress and the separate states may devise by law;
(05) Establish and maintain libraries, museums, schools, colleges and universities;
(06) Provide nutritional, lodging and other dwelling services as the bylaws of the church may direct and under such regulations as its trustees may devise;
(07) Provide assistance for the enforcement of the criminal laws of the United States and the several states upon the request of the Congress or the legislature of a state;
(08) Establish and maintain banks and other financial institutions under the regulations which the Congress and the separate states may devise by law;
(09) Provide as the bylaws of the church may direct and under such regulations as its trustees may devise, any other benefit to individual persons or associations thereof comparable to such benefits which the Congress or the legislatures of the several states may provide by law for the common welfare of the People of the United States or the People of any state;
(10) Perform any other service or function for the benefit of the general welfare of the United States or any state upon the request of Congress or the legislature of a state;
(11) Acquire private property for the purpose of performing any of the forgoing powers with the consent of and under such regulations as the Congress of the United States or the legislatures of the several states may devise;
(12) Obtain the full faith and credit of the several states for such persons which the Congress of the United States may certify and which the church may employ to implement the foregoing powers- and
(13) Take any action that is necessary and proper for the implementation of the foregoing powers to provide for the social welfare of the American People.
 
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Part II

Section 5: Churches established in accordance with this amendment shall retain the right to worship and proselytize without undue regulation of the United States or the several states and thereby shall have the power to:
(01) Acquire, use and convey real property;
(02) Acquire, use and convey chattel property subject to such taxation as may be determined by law;
(03) Conduct lawful commerce subject to such taxation as may be determined by law;
(04) Borrow money;
(05) Exercise freedom of the press in both print and electronic forms under the complete editorial control of the trustees of the church and such persons as they may designate without restrictions as to the number of press enterprises that may be operated;
(06) Petition the government of the United States and the governments of the several states for redress of grievances;
(07) Petition the electors for any office of public trust under the United States and any of the several states;
(08) Peaceably assemble its members and establish visual and audible displays in such places that are procured, established or otherwise maintained by tax revenue within the United States and which are open to the general public;
(09) Conduct, in a manner determined by the bylaws of the church and under such regulations as the trustees thereof may devise, lotteries and other games of chance in any state wherein the government thereof conducts such games;
(10) Acquire, hold and transfer stock in any corporation that may be chartered by the United States or by any one of the several states subject to such taxation as may be determined by law;
(11) Establish for-profit, not-for-profit and non-profit corporations that are necessary and proper for exercising any of the foregoing powers and to peaceably have the full and absolute use of all real property owned by the church or by any corporation wholly established or owned thereby for the purpose of worship, proselytism and providing for the social welfare of the American People.
(12) Exempt from taxation all property and income owned wholly by the church and by any corporation that is wholly established and owned by the church and exempt from taxation the income of any other corporation that may accrue to the church as a consequence of owning shares of stock therein.

Section 6: No employee, member, clergy, trustee, director or officer of any church established in accordance with this amendment or any corporation that is established or owned wholly or in part by any such church shall receive any portion of the revenue, income or property of such church or corporation except as a social welfare benefit or as reasonable compensation for services rendered and no compensation for any individual person shall exceed the value of one-hundred thousand dollars per annum.
The trustees of any church established in accordance with this amendment may require the employees of the church and the employees, directors and officers of any corporation established by the church or by any corporation, the majority of which is owned by the church, to be a member of the church or otherwise adhere to the doctrine thereof without consequence of any law.
The judicial power of the United States and the judicial power of each state shall extend to suits in law or equity within their respective jurisdictions for which a church or any corporation established or owned wholly or in part thereby or any employee, member, clergy, trustee, director or officer thereof shall be a party, but no employee, member, clergy, trustee, director or officer of any such church or corporation shall be questioned in regard to the doctrine of the church except in a time and place which the trustees of the church may determine.

Section 7: The American People and the corporations established thereby shall retain the right to contribute money to the churches that are established in accordance with this amendment for the purpose of securing a social welfare benefit for the contributors and such persons as they may designate and may in any year for which such contributions are made receive credit for any tax or fee that may otherwise be due as a consequence of any law implemented to provide a comparable benefit for the common welfare of the United States or any one of the several states.

Section 8: No provision in this amendment shall be construed to indicate or apply to any religion to the exclusion of any other.
 
Part I

In another thread I suggested that we should find ways to empower the private sector, especially churches, to deal with healthcare and other social welfare issues.
Seeing-as-how any churches' agenda is driven by matters of faith/spirituality, rather than known matters of fact, I'd rather empower them to mind their own business...especially involving matters of family-planning.

To-date, I've seen no need for anyone to be guided/influenced by purveyors of fairy-tales....even though Freepers & Dead-O-Heads do so, by choice (hardly an endorsement for sanity).

The private-sector is already dealing-with health-care.​
 
Seeing-as-how any churches' agenda is driven by matters of faith/spirituality, rather than known matters of fact, I'd rather empower them to mind their own business...especially involving matters of family-planning.

To-date, I've seen no need for anyone to be guided/influenced by purveyors of fairy-tales....even though Freepers & Dead-O-Heads do so, by choice (hardly an endorsement for sanity).

The private-sector is already dealing-with health-care.​

If you don’t want churches interfering in society shouldn’t you insist that society, i.e., government not interfere in churches? What right do you have to dictate what churches can do in the name of their religion? What right do you have to tell churches they must give up certain constitutional rights (to lobby the government for instance) in order to exercise other rights (such as to exist without being taxed into oblivion)? Hostility from the likes of you is one of the main reasons why churches are so impotent when it comes to doing any social welfare work, and that hostility is precisely why this amendment is needed.
 
If you don’t want churches interfering in society shouldn’t you insist that society, i.e., government not interfere in churches? What right do you have to dictate what churches can do in the name of their religion? What right do you have to tell churches they must give up certain constitutional rights (to lobby the government for instance) in order to exercise other rights (such as to exist without being taxed into oblivion)? Hostility from the likes of you is one of the main reasons why churches are so impotent when it comes to doing any social welfare work, and that hostility is precisely why this amendment is needed.

First let me say to you again that churches had all the freedom in the world to help people in the past and they simply could not keep up with the need.

They might be able to provided 5% today and I seriously doubt that. Nothing you have posted changes that fact in any way.

Furthermore it is most certainly not "hostility" to believe that if a church leaders start fundraizing and campaigning for specific candidates and issues that they should indeed lose their Tax Exempt status.

Perhaps you are uninformed of what the Tax Exemption is all about. As a religious organization churches are separate from the state. However this presumes that churches are doing church work. Once a church starts raising money for or campaigning for candidates it has then willfully crossed over from a church organization to a political action committee.

On top of that we need only look at the many pedophile priests, polygamist cults, David Koresh and Jim Jones types of the "religious" world to see that their is often a compelling public interest in government having stipulations on what a religious organization can and cannot do.

Separation of church and state protects the church from the state and equally protects Americans from the political views of any particular church being forced upon them.
 
If you don’t want churches interfering in society shouldn’t you insist that society, i.e., government not interfere in churches? What right do you have to dictate what churches can do in the name of their religion? What right do you have to tell churches they must give up certain constitutional rights (to lobby the government for instance) in order to exercise other rights (such as to exist without being taxed into oblivion)? Hostility from the likes of you is one of the main reasons why churches are so impotent when it comes to doing any social welfare work, and that hostility is precisely why this amendment is needed.
Hey....churches can do alllllllllllllllllllllllllllll o' the volunteer work they want....but, when they start insisting on proposing legislation, based on FAITH(????)...they've stepped WAAAAAAYYYYYYYY over-the-line!!!!!!

:mad:

BTW....if (perceived) hostility, from me, somehow cancels-out their social-welfare-work (due to imagined-martyrdom), maybe their faith isn't all that strong, to start-with. That's my fault?​
 
First let me say to you again that churches had all the freedom in the world to help people in the past and they simply could not keep up with the need.

They might be able to provided 5% today and I seriously doubt that. Nothing you have posted changes that fact in any way.

Furthermore it is most certainly not "hostility" to believe that if a church leaders start fundraizing and campaigning for specific candidates and issues that they should indeed lose their Tax Exempt status.

Perhaps you are uninformed of what the Tax Exemption is all about.
PREACH, BROTHA'!!!!!!!!!!!

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First let me say to you again that churches had all the freedom in the world to help people in the past and they simply could not keep up with the need.


At what point in history did the need outpace churches’ ability to meet it? Churches had to trade their political rights for tax exempt status long before the Great Society welfare state came along.

They might be able to provided 5% today and I seriously doubt that. Nothing you have posted changes that fact in any way.

Again, how are you calculating the need and how are you calculating churches’ ability to meet that need? If you measure churches’ ability in money, how much need could churches meet if they didn’t have to pay taxes and could use the same mechanisms that state governments use to raise money for social welfare programs, i.e., lotteries?

Furthermore it is most certainly not "hostility" to believe that if a church leaders start fundraizing and campaigning for specific candidates and issues that they should indeed lose their Tax Exempt status.

Why? Freedom of religion is a constitutional right. Participating in politics is a constitutional right. So what is it about putting the 2 together that causes one to cancel out the other? There was once a time when churches could participate in politics and were still tax exempt. But then Senator Lyndon Johnson decided to add an amendment to a tax law that was going through the Senate so he could silence some church pastors in Texas that had been criticizing his politics.

However this presumes that churches are doing church work.

Who in Hell are you to tell me what my church’s work can be? If a church requires its members to participate in politics, what right do you have to say those members cannot participate in politics? What right do you have to tell someone what their religion can be?

Once a church starts raising money for or campaigning for candidates it has then willfully crossed over from a church organization to a political action committee.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/527_Organization

A political action committee is still tax exempt.

On top of that we need only look at the many pedophile priests, polygamist cults, David Koresh and Jim Jones types of the "religious" world to see that their is often a compelling public interest in government having stipulations on what a religious organization can and cannot do.

Which tells me that haven’t actually read what I have proposed since the amendment has provisions to guard against cults.
 
Hey....churches can do alllllllllllllllllllllllllllll o' the volunteer work they want....but, when they start insisting on proposing legislation, based on FAITH(????)...they've stepped WAAAAAAYYYYYYYY over-the-line!!!!!!


Why? Churches have a long history of political involvement in this country and they could freely engage in political activities for hundreds of years before Lyndon Johnson put a gag order on them.​
 
Why? Churches have a long history of political involvement in this country and they could freely engage in political activities for hundreds of years before Lyndon Johnson put a gag order on them.
Whoops!!!!

You forgot to post any proof of that.

Better hurry..............​
 
Whoops!!!!

You forgot to post any proof of that.

Better hurry..............​

http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=161131,00.html

"In 1954, Congress approved an amendment by Sen. Lyndon Johnson to prohibit 501(c)(3) organizations, which includes charities and churches, from engaging in any political campaign activity. To the extent Congress has revisited the ban over the years, it has in fact strengthened the ban. The most recent change came in 1987 when Congress amended the language to clarify that the prohibition also applies to statements opposing candidates."

Liberals and libertarians have declared the First Amendment null and void because they have asumed unconstitutional authority to regulate churches, i.e., prohibit the free exercise of religion because libs cannot afford to risk being critcized from the pulpit.
 
Liberals and libertarians have declared the First Amendment null and void because they have asumed unconstitutional authority to regulate churches, i.e., prohibit the free exercise of religion because libs cannot afford to risk being critcized from the pulpit.
I think it's (more) a matter o' Libs having better things, to do, with their Lives....without the unnecessary-clutter of nutjobs (searching for someone-else's directives) contaminating the landscape.

:rolleyes:


*

 
I think it's (more) a matter o' Libs having better things, to do, with their Lives....without the unnecessary-clutter of nutjobs


Again a display of the libs’ innate hostility. You automatically label someone as crazy just because they have religious faith.
 
Again a display of the libs’ innate hostility. You automatically label someone as crazy just because they have religious faith.
Nope....just delusional (and, a little-bit intellectually-lazy).

There's a HUGE-difference, between what you Believe....and, what's (actually) KNOWN!!!!
 
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Nope....just delusional (and, a little-bit intellectually-lazy).​


Again hostility. You just cannot help yourself. You insist on attacking people just because of their religious faith. Suppose people were to call you stupid or ignorant or intellectually lazy just because of your left-wing political views? How would you feel if people thought you had to be an imbecile just because you are a liberal?​
 
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