$3.7 Trillion!!!

[Gipper]

How tedious it is to continue to read a Pavlovian response to uncomfortable facts and see my position caricaturized as some tax and spend liberal. It would be nice if you would actually read what I've posted instead of coming up with some juvenile rant that sounds like a regurgitation of right wing radio.

You protest too much my friend.

I did NOT accuse you of being a tax and spend liberal. I did dispute your advocacy for higher taxes. As you have elsewhere, you think higher taxes is the answer along with cuts.

So, I guess you are a tax and cut liberal. Does that work for you?

 

[Dr.Who]

The motives are the only thing that matters they have no intention of fixing the fiscal mess. They just want their projects to be the ones being spent on. Therefore replacing on suit for another is a worthless gesture when they both want the same thing.

Thank you for bringing this up. I would like to explore what you have siad more.

I agree that much of what politicians do is about getting their own projects funded. Is that all that they do?

Don't they have any agendas beyond their own projects? Don't they have an ideology that they want to further? Isn't some of what they do about advancing an agenda too?

What is our presidents agenda?

 

[Gipper]

Unbelievable.

Little Timmy Geithner dumps on BO's disastrous budget and admits that BO is playing politics with the budget process. What a leader BO is!!!

This administration has to be the most incompetent in a long time.

 

[dogtowner]

Unbelievable.

Little Timmy Geithner dumps on BO's disastrous budget and admits that BO is playing politics with the budget process. What a leader BO is!!!

This administration has to be the most incompetent in a long time.

They're great at doing what they intended to do. Trouble is its disastrous for the country. They're getting every last drop they can before the well is totally dry. Then someone else will have to deal with it while they're out living it up.

 

[PLC1]

You protest too much my friend.

I did NOT accuse you of being a tax and spend liberal. I did dispute your advocacy for higher taxes. As you have elsewhere, you think higher taxes is the answer along with cuts.

So, I guess you are a tax and cut liberal. Does that work for you?

I'm not sure I've ever heard that phrase before, but yes, what we need to do is increase taxes and cut spending.

Perhaps tax and cut realist is more apt.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

I'm not sure I've ever heard that phrase before, but yes, what we need to do is increase taxes and cut spending.

Perhaps tax and cut realist is more apt.

I think its called sane Moderate...I completely agree. there are places to cut, but we also have historic lows in taxes...we can raise them some and not have the world end.

What would the debt be today if Bush Never passed his tax cuts?

For 8 years republicans said nothing about the debt...
Fight 2 wars on the Credit card, while cutting taxes in a huge way.

Its like a person buying 2 million dollar homes...and then going into work and telling his boss he is taking a voluntary pay cut....then yelling latter about why they are so far in debt and blaming trying to find someone to blame.

 

[Rick]

I think its called sane Moderate...I completely agree. there are places to cut, but we also have historic lows in taxes...we can raise them some and not have the world end.

Raise taxes in the worst recession since the 1930s??? Again, I have the fantasy of all leftwingers marched to a prison camp, where the price of release is getting a grade of "A" in Economics 101.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Raise taxes in the worst recession since the 1930s??? Again, I have the fantasy of all leftwingers marched to a prison camp, where the price of release is getting a grade of "A" in Economics 101.

Yes

and don't give me this don't raise taxes when the econ is..X....

Republican Logic pre 2000....the econ is good...we should cut taxes and give back some of the surplus to the people ( not use it ti pay for debt)

econ starts to go down ....we need a tax cut to stimulate the econ...( oddly same tax cut)

2 wars? More tax cuts!

somehow the tax rate on those making millions...will not realy drag down the econ...cutting and cutting till the schools and police can't pay workers, and roads fall apart...while raising property taxes over and over to cover costs....that will.

 

[Gipper]

Lets see now...POS and THC are advocating for raising taxes. But, did the Dem Congress not just renew the Bush tax cuts? The Dems who always scream about tax cuts, passed tax cuts. Do they know something you two don't?

But that aside, it has been shown by others here at the HOP and by history, that the Feds do not raise revenue by increasing taxes. The tax take has been fairly consistent no matter what the tax rates are throughout history. This is a fact. Why have you two chosen not to accept facts? And, raising taxes can have a very detrimental effect particularly in a recession. Understand?

You raise revenue by implementing policies that grow the economy. Raising taxes does not grow the economy. It grows government. This is something that BO and you two know nothing about...apparently. BO did not learn anything in school...apparently. Had he studied Reaganomics instead of being silly socialists, he would know the solution.

Just another consequence America must suffer for electing a Marxist president.

 

[Dr.Who]

I'm not sure I've ever heard that phrase before, but yes, what we need to do is increase taxes and cut spending.

Perhaps tax and cut realist is more apt.

We can accomplish I all through cuts alone. Despite the talk of hard work to cut he budget it would not be hard at all.

Has anyone ever paid of debt in their own life?

Wasn't the first thing you did is to calculate the amount of payment that needed to be made and how much cut needed to be done to make that payment?

There are online calculators that will tell you based on how much you owe how much you need to pay every month and then it is easy to figure from your income how much you need to cut. Ta Da!

Has anyone noticed that no one has told us these two figures?

Does anyone suspect that games are being played with the budget? That no one is really serious about reducing the deficit or the debt?

 

[Dr.Who]

I think its called sane Moderate...I completely agree. there are places to cut, but we also have historic lows in taxes...we can raise them some and not have the world end.

What would the debt be today if Bush Never passed his tax cuts?

For 8 years republicans said nothing about the debt...
Fight 2 wars on the Credit card, while cutting taxes in a huge way.

Its like a person buying 2 million dollar homes...and then going into work and telling his boss he is taking a voluntary pay cut....then yelling latter about why they are so far in debt and blaming trying to find someone to blame.

I agree that the pubs did not complain about the debt during the Bush years. We should vote the scoundrels out.

If by historic lows in taxes you mean that the gov is not taking in much money you would be right. That is because less people are making any money to be taxed.

If by historic lows in taxes you mean that the tax rates are as low as they should be I would disagree. A tax in which everyone pays the same amount and everyone has just one basic write off could easily pay for government at between 10 and 15%.

Did the Bush tax cuts hurt the economy?

"Although the cuts were large and drove revenue down sharply, they are not the main cause of the sizable deficit that exists today. In 2007, well after the tax cuts took effect, the budget deficit stood at 1.2 percent of GDP. By 2009, it had increased to 9.9 percent of the economy. The Bush tax cuts didn't change between 2007 and 2009, so clearly something else is to blame. "
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/30/AR2010073002671.html

That something else of course is too much spending.

However a number of credible sources agree that the tax cuts increased revenue. Here is one source:

"But the real jolt for tax-cutting opponents was that the 03 Bush tax cuts also generated a massive increase in federal tax receipts. From 2004 to 2007, federal tax revenues increased by $785 billion, the largest four-year increase in American history. According to the Treasury Department, individual and corporate income tax receipts were up 40 percent in the three years following the Bush tax cuts. And (bonus) the rich paid an even higher percentage of the total tax burden than they had at any time in at least the previous 40 years. This was news to theNew York Times, whose astonished editorial board could only describe the gains as a “surprise windfall.”

Unfortunately, Mr. Bush allowed Congress to spend away those additional tax revenues. The fact is that the increase in tax revenues that flowed from the ‘03 tax cuts could have paid for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and then some but for rampant discretionary domestic spending. "
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/3/bush-tax-cuts-boosted-federal-revenue/

The real culprits were the dot com bubble burst the housing burst and the two wars coupled with foolish domestic spending.

 

[Dr.Who]

Raise taxes in the worst recession since the 1930s??? Again, I have the fantasy of all leftwingers marched to a prison camp, where the price of release is getting a grade of "A" in Economics 101.

HI Rick,

You bring up a valid point. Was it the worst recession?

If we measure it by how hard it hit then no it was not.

If we measure it by how long it was then that phrase was being used long before it was the longest recession. It only became longer than other recessions after President Obama's policies failed to address the problems of he recessions and actually caused it to last longer.

 

[Dr.Who]

Lets see now...POS and THC are advocating for raising taxes. But, did the Dem Congress not just renew the Bush tax cuts? The Dems who always scream about tax cuts, passed tax cuts. Do they know something you two don't?

But that aside, it has been shown by others here at the HOP and by history, that the Feds do not raise revenue by increasing taxes. The tax take has been fairly consistent no matter what the tax rates are throughout history. This is a fact. Why have you two chosen not to accept facts? And, raising taxes can have a very detrimental effect particularly in a recession. Understand?

You raise revenue by implementing policies that grow the economy. Raising taxes does not grow the economy. It grows government. This is something that BO and you two know nothing about...apparently. BO did not learn anything in school...apparently. Had he studied Reaganomics instead of being silly socialists, he would know the solution.

Just another consequence America must suffer for electing a Marxist president.

This part about revenues not going up with higher tax rates is true on average.

 

[PLC1]

We can accomplish I all through cuts alone. Despite the talk of hard work to cut he budget it would not be hard at all.

Not likely. It might be theoretically possible, but it is not politically possible.

Has anyone ever paid of debt in their own life?

Yes, many times. Mostly, it was made possible by increased income.

Wasn't the first thing you did is to calculate the amount of payment that needed to be made and how much cut needed to be done to make that payment?

There are online calculators that will tell you based on how much you owe how much you need to pay every month and then it is easy to figure from your income how much you need to cut. Ta Da!

Has anyone noticed that no one has told us these two figures?

Does anyone suspect that games are being played with the budget? That no one is really serious about reducing the deficit or the debt?

Yes, absolutely. Both parties are telling us what they think we want to hear. The truth is that the country is deep in debt, and that it is going to take some sacrifices to get out. No one wants to hear that, and neither side will address the real issues.

 

[Rick]

Yes

and don't give me this don't raise taxes when the econ is..X....

Republican Logic pre 2000....the econ is good...we should cut taxes and give back some of the surplus to the people ( not use it ti pay for debt)

econ starts to go down ....we need a tax cut to stimulate the econ...( oddly same tax cut)

2 wars? More tax cuts!

somehow the tax rate on those making millions...will not realy drag down the econ...cutting and cutting till the schools and police can't pay workers, and roads fall apart...while raising property taxes over and over to cover costs....that will.

You represent one of the key flaws in a democracy - the militantly ignorant who have a vote.