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Honour Killing

Discussion in 'House of Politics Lounge' started by Iftikhar, Jan 27, 2008.

  1. Iftikhar

    Iftikhar Member

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    Honour Killing
    Honour killing and female infanticide come from Pagan-Hindu-Judeo-Christian traditions. Hindus idolise women as Goddesses on one hand, while downgrading them on the sly at the same time. There is nothing in the Holy Quran and the Hadiths that may encourage people to kill their daughters. Infact, Islam came to abolish the dark ages of Pagan- Hindu –Judeo- Christian traditions. Islam is a matter of choice and there is no compulsion at all. It is a misconception that forced marriage and honour killing are part of Muslim culture. Forced marriage, honour killing and genital mutilation are rare practices among migrant communities. Muslim migrants are worried about institutional racism, binge drinking, drug addiction, incivility, gun and knife crimes, high rate of abortions and teen age pregnancies. An average of 20 English girls under the age of 16 falls pregnant every day. Muslim parents do not want their children to be integrated into such barbarity. Muslim women feel torn between two cultures, thanks to the British education system with non-Muslim monolingual teachers. It makes their lives very confusing.

    The tragedy of forced marriage and honour killing could have been avoided if the poor girls were educated in a single sex state funded Muslim schools by female Muslim teachers. Educational attainment rises quite significantly if boys and girls are educated separately. The tragedies are an eye opener for all those Muslim parents who send their children to state schools where they are exposed to non-Muslim teachers who have no respect for Islamic faith and Muslim community and do not understand the needs and demands of the Muslim children. Muslim schools are crucial for Muslim children because western education makes a man/woman stupid. The hypocrisy of the Western society is clearly seen whereas an Australian Judge failed to jail nine males who admitted gang-raping a 10-year old aborigine girl in 2005, saying the victim probably agreed to have sex with them and a UNICEF Photo of the year shows, a bridegroom, 40, with his 11-year old bride in Afghanistan. In my opinion, a UNICEF photo of the year must show a nine year British girl having a baby and another photo showing a gang of teenage girls with anti-social behaviour and vomiting out side a pub, thanks to binge drinking. Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with Muslim teachers as role models during their developmental periods. Muslim schools are the solutions and not a problem. They help to strengthen community cohesion, not undermine it. Muslim schools stand as shining beacons of light, serving as one of the most crucial factors which protect Muslim children from the onslaught of Eurocentricism, homosexuality, racism and secular values and traditions. They need to be well versed in Standard English to follow the National Curriculum and go for higher studies and research to serve humanity. At the same time they need to be well versed in Arabic, Urdu and other community languages to keep in touch with their cultural roots and enjoy the beauty of their literature and poetry. Muslim schools are not only faith schools but also bilingual schools. Infact, bilingualism is an asset and not a problem as perceived by the British education system. There is a positive co-relation between language and culture. English language is associated with western culture.

    The silent majority of Muslim parents would like to send their children to Muslim schools but there are not enough schools to go by. The only alternative left is either British Government should introduce voucher system for parents to choose the school of their choice or designate all those state schools as Muslim community schools where Muslim pupils are in majority. There are hundreds of state schools where Muslims are in majority. Such schools may be handed over to Muslim educational Trusts or charities for their management. They are in a better position to educate Muslim children in accordance with their needs and demands. This demand is in accordance with the law of the land because there are state schools already managed by private companies. Muslim community is not asking for a favour. It is their legal right.
    Iftikhar Ahmad

    Please stop putting your link in your posts. It's spam.
     
  2. bewitched

    bewitched New Member

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    the only place that honor killing is taking place is in Islam.

    stop blaming the problems within Islam on the West.
     
  3. bewitched

    bewitched New Member

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    and here's another example of peaceful islam:
    "(IsraelNN.com) Fatah chief and PA Chairman Mahmoud Abbas's PA television has been repeatedly broadcasting a hate-filled music video calling for the ethnic cleansing of the Jewish people from Israel.
    "My enemy, oh snake! Around the land, you are coiled. You have no choice, oh enemy, but to leave my country," is the refrain in the video, which has been broadcast on a daily basis for the past several months, according to Palestinian Media Watch (PMW)."
     
  4. Iftikhar

    Iftikhar Member

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    Salaam


    Majority of Muslim children leave schools with low grades because state
    schools with monolingual teachers are not capable of teacing Standard
    English to bilingual Muslim children.

    Bilingual Muslim children need state funded Muslim schools with bilingual
    Muslim teachers as role models. They need to be well versed in Standard
    English to follow the National Curriculum and go for higher studies and
    research to serve humanity. They need to be well versed in Arabic, Urdu and
    other community languages to keep in touch with their cultural roots anbd
    enjoy the beauty of their literature and poetry.

    A Muslim is a citizen of this tiny global village. He/she does not want to
    become notoriously monolingual Brit.
     
  5. 9sublime

    9sublime Active Member

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    Oh, look whos back.

    Well, it happens in the West even less so its certainly not because of western culture is it? Its something that has spawned out of Islam, and its a problem Islam needs to accept and deal with in itself.

    This is just ridiculous. So its our culture's fault that the honour killings occured? Why can't you take the blame for it yourself. Your culture does honour killings, you need to deal with it.


    Well then **** off home mate. Come here, intergrate, be tolerant and expect the same back. I hate racists who attack Muslims or blacks etc. because of their skin colour or religion - but if you come here and attack our way of life you are just as bad. You are a racist yourself, a Muslim bigot.

    If its so bad here, why don't you piss off back to wherever its so great with an Islamic government enforcing its way on everyone.

    Homosexuality is not an onslaught, your Islam induced intoleranc however certainly is.

    Secular values? What exactly are they? I don't follow a religion and I live a wholesome life and don't go around murdering and raping.

    Eurocentrism? You don't have to deal with it if you leave Europe and go to a Muslim country.

    Racism? Maybe if you weren't so pro segregation and realised intergrating is the only approach Muslims would recieve a bit less racism back. Segregation is racist in itself, even if your race is the one promoting it. Calling western education stupid and western society hypocritical is a form of racism.


    Silent majority? What a cheap cop out. Everyone wants it, they just don't say. Well, hey, we live in a democracy, not some theocratic dictatorship, and here you say what you want and if the majority want it you get it. Until that happens, I certainly hope we don't go around funding this ridiculous idea of segregating Muslims.
     
  6. Coyote

    Coyote Active Member

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    Actually you are wrong. There is nothing in Islam itself that concerning honor killing.


    From Wikipedia:

    The killing of (a possibly adulterous) wife by an enraged husband or the killing of a male by the family of (a supposedly dishonoured) female is or was common and often condoned in many cultures. Such a cultural attitude was often reflected in a reduced sentence for such a murder by the judicial system. However the killing of females by their own family members is rare except in tribal cultures of the Middle East, Near East and South Asia. In the West, such murder is perceived to be exclusively associated with Muslim communities. Honour killing of female family members occurs among some rural Muslim communities with a strongly feudal tribal culture, as well as Druze tribes in some Arab countries and Pakistan, although it is much rarer or non-existent in the Muslim communities of Kazakhstan, Kyrghyzstan, most of Central Asia, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, sub-Saharan Africa, Malaysia and Indonesia. It also occurs among Sikh adherents in India and Canada.

    Islamic religious authorities prohibit extra-legal punishments such as honour killings, since they consider the practice to be a cultural issue.[24] They believe that since certain pre-Islamic cultures have influence over a number of Muslims, murderers of females use Islam to justify honour killing, but claim that there is no support for the act in the religion itself.
     
  7. bewitched

    bewitched New Member

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    yote, get a grip. honor killing isn't happening in Cleveland, San Diego, Paris, or Toronto. it's happening in Pakistan, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Saudi, Libya, and all other places in Islam.
    honor killing is usually carried out by fathers, uncles, brothers against girls who are raped and no longer marriage material.
    this is usually after their clits are cut off.
     
  8. Coyote

    Coyote Active Member

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    Coyote died for your sheep
    Where in the Koran does it say anything about Honor Killing?

    You're the "expert"...show me....
     
  9. 9sublime

    9sublime Active Member

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    I don't think bewitched is claiming the Koran ever says honour killing is right, I just think he is pointing out how ****ing ridiculous it is for this man to try and blame western culture for honour killings happening by people in Arabic, African or Eastern countries or people of Eastern and Arabic, and African descent in the UK
     
  10. Coyote

    Coyote Active Member

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    Oh...I'm not so sure.


    He said: "...and all other places in Islam. " and that is flat out wrong.

    However - I agree, the original poster is flat out wrong.
     
  11. bewitched

    bewitched New Member

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    I'm a she. and other places in Islam include Indonesia, and even muslim communities in Chechnya, the Stans, Thailand. and yes, honor killings take place there too.
     
  12. Coyote

    Coyote Active Member

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    Whatever you say Steve....you are still wrong.


    Repeat:

    From Wikipedia:

    The killing of (a possibly adulterous) wife by an enraged husband or the killing of a male by the family of (a supposedly dishonoured) female is or was common and often condoned in many cultures. Such a cultural attitude was often reflected in a reduced sentence for such a murder by the judicial system. However the killing of females by their own family members is rare except in tribal cultures of the Middle East, Near East and South Asia. In the West, such murder is perceived to be exclusively associated with Muslim communities. Honour killing of female family members occurs among some rural Muslim communities with a strongly feudal tribal culture, as well as Druze tribes in some Arab countries and Pakistan, although it is much rarer or non-existent in the Muslim communities of Kazakhstan, Kyrghyzstan, most of Central Asia, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, sub-Saharan Africa, Malaysia and Indonesia. It also occurs among Sikh adherents in India and Canada.

    Islamic religious authorities prohibit extra-legal punishments such as honour killings, since they consider the practice to be a cultural issue.[24] They believe that since certain pre-Islamic cultures have influence over a number of Muslims, murderers of females use Islam to justify honour killing, but claim that there is no support for the act in the religion itself.[/QUOTE]
     
  13. ilikeboobs

    ilikeboobs Member

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    Up your butt, Jobu.

    How about they learn English before immigrating? That's the only problem I have with immigrants today (unless it's an emergency to save your life) is that they go somewhere better yet expect the host country to cater to them, to bend to whatever they need. Sorry - my compassion only goes so far.
     
  14. bewitched

    bewitched New Member

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    [/QUOTE]
    Steve? ahhhhh. you think I'm someone else.
    why?
    wikipedia is very interesting but you have to apply the words to reality.
     
  15. Coyote

    Coyote Active Member

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    Coyote died for your sheep

    Sorry. Typo.



    You need other sources to confirm reality?

    Reports submitted to the United Nations Commission on Human Rights show that honor killings have occurred in Bangladesh, Great Britain, Brazil, Ecuador, Egypt, India, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Pakistan, Morocco, Sweden, Turkey, and Uganda. In countries not submitting reports to the UN, the practice was condoned under the rule of the fundamentalist Taliban government in Afghanistan, and has been reported in Iraq and Iran.

    But while honor killings have elicited considerable attention and outrage, human rights activists argue that they should be regarded as part of a much larger problem of violence against women.

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2002/02/0212_020212_honorkilling.html

    In India, for example, more than 5,000 brides die annually because their dowries are considered insufficient, according to the United Nations Children's Fund (UNICEF). Crimes of passion, which are treated extremely leniently in Latin America, are the same thing with a different name, some rights advocates say.

    "In countries where Islam is practiced, they're called honor killings, but dowry deaths and so-called crimes of passion have a similar dynamic in that the women are killed by male family members and the crimes are perceived as excusable or understandable," said Widney Brown, advocacy director for Human Rights Watch.

    The practice, she said, "goes across cultures and across religions."

    http://www.gendercide.org/case_honour.html

    Most "honour" killings of women occur in Muslim countries, the focus of this case study; but it is worth noting that no sanction for such murders is granted in Islamic religion or law. And the phenomenon is in any case a global one. According to Stephanie Nebehay, such killings "have been reported in Bangladesh, Britain, Brazil, Ecuador, Egypt, India, Israel, Italy, Jordan, Pakistan, Morocco, Sweden, Turkey and Uganda." Afghanistan, where the practice is condoned under the rule of the fundamentalist Taliban movement, can be added to the list, along with Iraq and Iran. (Nebehay, "'Honor Killings' of Women Said on Rise Worldwide," Reuters dispatch, April 7, 2000.)
     
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