Seasteading

[GenSeneca]

Ever heard of Seasteading? I hadn't either, till some time last year. I quickly became intrigued by the concept and have spent the last year watching the concept grow and evolve. Visit the Seasteading Institute or Wiki for more information on Seasteading. I do hope to see it become a reality but that's not really the purpose of this post...

It's no secret that those of us on the HOP greatly disagree on an "ideal" form of government so I thought discussing your very own Seastead-City-State would make for an interesting conversation. What kind of government would you have? How would your population survive? Where would you want your Seastead located? Etc.

I'll offer details on my idea for a Seasted when I have more time to post. Till then, I hope some of you will jump in and participate!

 

[Gipper]

Ever heard of Seasteading? I hadn't either, till some time last year. I quickly became intrigued by the concept and have spent the last year watching the concept grow and evolve. Visit the Seasteading Institute or Wiki for more information on Seasteading. I do hope to see it become a reality but that's not really the purpose of this post...

It's no secret that those of us on the HOP greatly disagree on an "ideal" form of government so I thought discussing your very own Seastead-City-State would make for an interesting conversation. What kind of government would you have? How would your population survive? Where would you want your Seastead located? Etc.

I'll offer details on my idea for a Seasted when I have more time to post. Till then, I hope some of you will jump in and participate!

Very cool idea. I had never heard of it.

Living on a cruise ship like vessel were individual liberty reigns and liberalism does not exist, sounds very good to me. But, what would I do with my beloved dogs?

 

[dahermit]

Very cool idea. I had never heard of it.

Living on a cruise ship like vessel were individual liberty reigns and liberalism does not exist, sounds very good to me. But, what would I do with my beloved dogs?

Take them with you...in your "Conservative Paradise", the poor would likely end up having to eat them.

 

[Centrehalf]

This sounds like a really cool idea, I can't believe I've never heard of this until now.

I'm not really sure how diverse the government options could be in the early stages when the populations of these seasteads are only going to be in the dozens, but it'll be interesting to see what they all choose to do if this ever gets going.

I'd want mine located in the Pacific, near Hawaii so if there were an emergency it wouldn't be too difficult to get to land. One thing in the link that jumped out at me right away was the part about Medical Tourism. I wonder if that would result in diplomatic problems with some countries?

 

[GenSeneca]

Gipper, take your dogs with you... But it's more likely you'd be living on a specialized deep sea platform than a cruise ship. Cruise ships need to be dry docked every year or two, as do most ocean going vessels. Deep sea platforms can remain at sea for much longer periods.

Dahermit, you should be a big supporter of seasteading. Just think of all those people you hate and hope to one day guillotine... You could be rid of them without bloodshed. Of course then you couldn't steal everything they own, so maybe that's why you don't like seasteading.

Centrehalf, you should learn more about seasteading. I for one would be happy to stop pulling the wagon of the welfare state and live on the ocean. As for being close to land, you'd have to be at least 200 miles offshore, in international waters, for any hope of political autonomy.

On a side note related to seasteading, I'm a big fan of sailboats and trimarans in particular. I'd like to buy one and live on it... a one man seastead if you will. There are two companies in particular who have very nice options, Corsair and Dragonfly. If anyone is interested, or just bored, check out the links and visit their sites. They both have lots of photos of their different models, complete with interior shots and floorplans.

Corsair F31

Dragonfly 1200

Seriously... You should check out their sites and have a look at the interiors... Amazing.

 

[dahermit]

Dahermit, you should be a big supporter of seasteading. Just think of all those people you hate and hope to one day guillotine...

You say that like somehow that is a bad thing.

 

[GenSeneca]

I posted my seastead concept over at SSI. Here's a link to the post along with the concept overview. If you want to see the pretty pictures and a more thorough explanation of the concept, click the link and check it out.

GenSeneca's Seastead Concept

Conceptual Overview: A floating platform is used to harvest seaweed and/or kelp, which is then turned into mash and distilled to make ethanol. The ethanol is burned in turbines which power the platform, farming vessels, and a small bulk carrier. The used mash is dried into powdered seaweed/kelp, loaded onto the small bulk carrier, and sold in bulk at a nearby port.

Harvesting one acre per day will produce just over 2400 gallons of ethanol, half of which is used to create a minimum of 30 MW and a maximum of 70 MW of power for the platform. One of the daily byproducts is roughly 40,000 lbs of seaweed/kelp powder and, if sold for $1/lb, translates into $40k/day income, or $14.6 million per year. There is one last byproduct, the seawater drained from the seaweed/kelp is filtered to make fresh water and stored.​

 

[dahermit]

There is one last byproduct, the seawater drained from the seaweed/kelp is filtered to make fresh water and stored.

Why bother? The ocean itself is an unlimited supply of salt water from which a semi-permeable membrane can be used to obtain fresh water. In your seaweed harvesting scenario, the salt water on the seaweed would just be drained back into the ocean. It is not a "by product".

Also, have you done any market research to determine if there is a market for the dried seaweed/kelp powder?

 

[GenSeneca]

Why bother? The ocean itself is an unlimited supply of salt water from which a semi-permeable membrane can be used to obtain fresh water. In your seaweed harvesting scenario, the salt water on the seaweed would just be drained back into the ocean. It is not a "by product".

Because the product has to be pressed before being ground into mash, making the water that's pressed out of it a byproduct. May as well filter that water since it's already on board rather than letting it "drain back into the ocean" and waste energy to pump new water on board.

The entire operation is 100% carbon neutral, uses renewable biofuel for power, relies on organic farming to produce food, and 100% of what's brought out of the ocean is utilized so that nothing goes to waste... I guess finding an environmentally friendly way to earn a profit doesn't mean anything to a guy who's idea of utopia is cutting people's heads off and stealing their money.

Also, have you done any market research to determine if there is a market for the dried seaweed/kelp powder?

If you would have bothered going to the link and reading the entire post you wouldn't need to ask these questions.

This 1lb bag of powdered kelp is listed as being "on sale" for $11.75/lb, regular price $14.75/lb.

 

[dahermit]

Because the product has to be pressed before being ground into mash, making the water that's pressed out of it a byproduct. May as well filter that water since it's already on board rather than letting it "drain back into the ocean" and waste energy to pump new water on board.

Reverse osmosis in a "sea-steading" scenario would more likely consist of a large storage tank beneath the surface that does not require the expenditure of energy for pumping. The sea water flows into the tank via gravity or natural convection.

The entire operation is 100% carbon neutral, uses renewable biofuel for power, relies on organic farming to produce food, and 100% of what's brought out of the ocean is utilized so that nothing goes to waste... I guess finding an environmentally friendly way to earn a profit doesn't mean anything to a guy who's idea of utopia is cutting people's heads off and stealing their money.

No, that is my idea of heaven. And stealing is how neuvo-robber barons get "their" money in the first place.

If you would have bothered going to the link and reading the entire post you wouldn't need to ask these questions.
This 1lb bag of powdered kelp is listed as being "on sale" for $11.75/lb, regular price $14.75/lb.

And if your thinking were not so parochial, you would realize that just because the price of dried kelp is such, it does not necessarily mean that the market could absorb a larger supply given that the people who are interested in consuming kelp are the few health-food nuts.

 

[GenSeneca]

The sea water flows into the tank via gravity or natural convection.

That's exactly what happens to the water that's pressed out of the kelp.

stealing is how neuvo-robber barons get "their" money in the first place.

Logical Fallacy,

Two wrongs make a right: occurs when it is assumed that if one wrong is committed, another wrong will cancel it out.
​

And if your thinking were not so parochial, you would realize that just because the price of dried kelp is such, it does not necessarily mean that the market could absorb a larger supply given that the people who are interested in consuming kelp are the few health-food nuts.

Powdered seaweed/kelp is a $19 billion a year industry and the product is used for fertilizer, chicken feed, a nutrient dense filler for pet food, and whole host of other uses. There is plenty of room in the market for another source.

Lastly, I know it's a lot to ask but please leave your attitude problem at the door if you want to post in this thread. Other threads, feel free to be pissy with me but this thread has nothing to do with politics.

 

[dahermit]

Lastly, I know it's a lot to ask but please leave your attitude problem at the door if you want to post in this thread. Other threads, feel free to be pissy with me but this thread has nothing to do with politics.

Gosh, if one would review previous posts in this thread, one would see who started being pissy...and political.

 

[GenSeneca]

Gosh, if one would review previous posts in this thread, one would see who started being pissy...and political.

You did in Post #3:

Take them with you...in your "Conservative Paradise", the poor would likely end up having to eat them.

Seriously, for this one thread lets bury the hatchet and discuss the merits of seasteading. Isn't there anything about the concept of seasteading that you like?

 

[dahermit]

You did in Post #3:

In a post aimed at "The Gipper".

Seriously, for this one thread lets bury the hatchet and discuss the merits of seasteading. Isn't there anything about the concept of seasteading that you like?

I like everything about it except that the lifestyle of living in that environment seems too confining to me. Days and days of boredom (I was a merchant seaman for five years...it takes a certain type of person to live under those conditions.). As for its production of ethanol however, I would be in favor of it if it turns out to be economically feasible.

 

[Gipper]

Details says the experiment would be "a kind of floating petri dish for implementing policies that libertarians, stymied by indifference at the voting booths, have been unable to advance: no welfare, looser building codes, no minimum wage, and few restrictions on weapons."
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/silicon-valley-billionaire-funding-creation-artificial-libertarian-islands-140840896.html

And, if they outlaw liberals and liberalism, I am ready to go!!!