Woman in Bible & Quran!

[Untouchable]

Reading the bible would make you more and more interested by Woman status in Christianism!
Women are considered as dirt that defiles men in the bible:

Revelation 14:4 "Those are those (men) who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as first fruits to God and the Lamb."

The bible considers the Birth of any female is a loss: Ecclesiasticus 22:3 "....and the birth of ANY daughter is a loss" (From the New Jerusalem Bible. It's a Roman Catholics Bible).


Fathers can sell their daughters as slave girls: Exodus 21:7-8 "And in case a man should sell his daughter as a slave girl, she will not go out in the way that the slave men go out. If she is displeasing in the eyes of her master so that he doesn't designate her as a concubine but causes her to be redeemed, he will not be entitled to sell her to a foreign people in his treacherously dealing with her."

Daughters inherit nothing when there are sons:
"If a man dies and leaves no son, turn his inheritance over to his daughter. (Numbers 27:8)" So the American law of splitting everything equally is not Biblical.

Women are not allowed to speak in the church:
"let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law, and if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for woman to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:34-35



In the bible:
To the woman (Eve) He (God) said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."

In Christianity: Woman is a daughter of falsehood (Saint John Damascene)


In Christianity: Woman is the fountain of the arm of the Devil, her voice is the hissing of the serpent (St. Anthony)


Comparison btwn Islam and Christianity
http://www.christianity-islam.com/woman.html

Any Comment?

 

[Coyote]

In short - historically, it SUCKED to be a woman in any of the Abrahamic faiths. Wasn't so hot in the Hindu faith either...

Ancient man was scared ****less of woman.

 

[Bunz]

Coyote, I will agree. Another notch in the ole bible is obsolete belt.

 

[Coyote]

I say it's time to kickass

 

[Bunz]

Shred em up, pup!

 

[r0beph]

I wouldn't mind finding me a nice young christian concubine I could purchase and keep on hand for those times when boredom creep in. Explain how keeping a concubine is ok in the bible yet...having sex while not married to a woman is not...I'm confused.

 

[Untouchable]

...But The situation in Kuran seems clearly better!
http://www.christianity-islam.com/woman.html
http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac9.htm#links

 

[r0beph]

...But The situation in Kuran seems clearly better!
http://www.christianity-islam.com/woman.html
http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac9.htm#links

In truth however, what is said in either book matters little, it's what people do with it that does. In many sects of christianity, even here in the US, women are treated pretty horribly (see some of the holiness factions, where the woman has many rules concerning her atire, her relation to her husband, her ability to CHOOSE who she wishes to love, etc) Islam is no different, regardless of what the book says, there are many who even KILL women over things such as infidelity and make a claim this is religious right.

The people make the words into reality, not the other way around. So to me I don't give a crap about what either book says, I only care about those who institute it and how.

 

[Bunz]

The bible and most religious text are similar to communism. Fantastic ideas of peace and harmony and all that jazz, do XYZ, and prosperity will be yours...all of them make sense on paper. It is a matter of the practicality of putting the practice of it to good use.

 

[Coyote]

In truth however, what is said in either book matters little, it's what people do with it that does.

That is one thing that PaleRider emphasized in a discussion on political ideologies - the difference between something in theory and something in practice. I've come to agree with that.

 

[Dr.Who]

Reading the bible would make you more and more interested by Woman status in Christianism!
Women are considered as dirt that defiles men in the bible:

Alternatively misreading the Bible would just make one wrong. From the creatin story and on the Bible affirms the worth of women.

Revelation 14:4 "Those are those (men) who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as first fruits to God and the Lamb."

The bible considers the Birth of any female is a loss: Ecclesiasticus 22:3 "....and the birth of ANY daughter is a loss" (From the New Jerusalem Bible. It's a Roman Catholics Bible).

Since the book of Ecclesiasticus is not in my bible I won't comment.

Fathers can sell their daughters as slave girls: Exodus 21:7-8 "And in case a man should sell his daughter as a slave girl, she will not go out in the way that the slave men go out. If she is displeasing in the eyes of her master so that he doesn't designate her as a concubine but causes her to be redeemed, he will not be entitled to sell her to a foreign people in his treacherously dealing with her."

This passage is full of laws about things people are not suppose to do. It says things like "if a man strikes another..." The wording is not suppose to indicate that fathers are suppose to sell their daughters into slavery any more than it says that men are supposed to strike each other.

The Bible recognized that men would hit each other and men would sell themselves as slaves (which was much more like a job back then and did not resemble slavery as practiced in the US 200 yrs ago). It then set limits on striking and slavery and a whole bunch of other stuff. That pasage says that every male slave would have to be set free and every female slave would have to be set free in a different way called "redemption".

Daughters inherit nothing when there are sons:
"If a man dies and leaves no son, turn his inheritance over to his daughter. (Numbers 27:8)" So the American law of splitting everything equally is not Biblical.

Actually the Americans have no "way" as a person is free to give all his inheritance to his cats if he wants to and leave none to any children.

But daughters did sometimes inherit things even when there were sons. Like here it was up to the parent. If the daughter got married then she would share her husbands inheritance and the parent might choose to give it to the son. But he might choose to give it to her anway - it was his choice. The passage did not limit parents from giving anything to daughters but said that if there were no sons it couldn't be "given to the cats".

Women are not allowed to speak in the church:
"let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law, and if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for woman to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:34-35

In this one church the women had a habit of jumping up and yelling questions to thier husbands or others who were seated on the other side. Clearly they should be quite during the service. In the same book it talks about how women should speak - indicating that it was OK for them to talk. They just shouldnt yell.

In the bible:
To the woman (Eve) He (God) said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."

Which was a prophetic curse that has turned out to be true. Men have ruled women for most of human history. The other part of the curse was that men would work hard in the fields which also came true. Today we do everthing we can to overcome the hard work in the fields and should also do whatever we can to overcome the tendency for men to dominate women.

In Christianity: Woman is a daughter of falsehood (Saint John Damascene)

Do you have any source that demonstrates that this was actually said by that guy? And who was that guy and why should I care? I man was he Jesus? Does he speak for Jesus or God?

In Christianity: Woman is the fountain of the arm of the Devil, her voice is the hissing of the serpent (St. Anthony)

Again, did Jesus say that? do you have any evidence that St. Anthony said that? If he did so what?

Any Comment?

Don't believe everything someone tells you to believe.

Try this one:

Galatians 3:8
There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

 

[Divine Love]

Just want to make a point
Christianity was a divine religion that got mixed with loads of superstitious ideas. For one thing, the first versions of bible appeared decades after Jesus's so-called Ascension. How can bible's teachings be kept intact after several decades?
So I believe the current christian thoughts can't be assigned to real Christianity?

 

[Dr.Who]

Just want to make a point
Christianity was a divine religion that got mixed with loads of superstitious ideas. For one thing, the first versions of bible appeared decades after Jesus's so-called Ascension. How can bible's teachings be kept intact after several decades?
So I believe the current christian thoughts can't be assigned to real Christianity?

The first letters were written decades after His ascension - true. But decades means that it was within the lifetime of the actual witnesses. Most of the writers were the actual people who traveled with Jesus. If what they said or who they claimed to be should have been called into question then the thousands of people who wittnessed the events/lack of events had the opportunity to step forward and speak out. Instead of thousands of other witnesses speaking out that the testimony of the Bible was wrong, we have instead, witnesses speaking out to say that they too saw the same things.

The things written about match history as much as can be confirmed - the places talked about actually exist, the people actually existed, and the events actually existed. Many of the places, people and events have been corroborted, many have not been corroborated, but none have been contradicted.

Using textual criticism as a historical tool we know that the contents of the letters are almost exactly what they were when they were first written. We also know what the errors are; and most of the errors are equivalent to saying that a "T" was not crossed or an "i" was not dotted. None of these so-called errors change the meaning or the main message.

So I believe the current Christian thoughts can be assigned to real Christianity

 

[Divine Love]

Muslims beleive that all the messengers were sent by a single god (Allah)
But when you ask a muslim clergy why all these single-sourced religions are so much contradictive in the most essential thoughts they respond by saying that they are all alterd by ill-intended people. One reasoning is the time gap and the other is the fact that the first bible(s) appeard not in the Jesus's language. (First bibbles in Greek while they should have been in Hebrew).

For more info:
Quran explains the story of many messengers like Jesus, Joseph, Solomon, ...
While there is a lot of similarities in the whole outline of the stories there are some serious contradictions in some details that make a big difference in the message that is conveyed to the reader while comparing Quran and Bibble.

I recommend reading Quran entirely for those who do religious researches.

 

[Dr.Who]

Muslims beleive that all the messengers were sent by a single god (Allah)
But when you ask a muslim clergy why all these single-sourced religions are so much contradictive in the most essential thoughts they respond by saying that they are all alterd by ill-intended people. One reasoning is the time gap and the other is the fact that the first bible(s) appeard not in the Jesus's language. (First bibbles in Greek while they should have been in Hebrew).

For more info:
Quran explains the story of many messengers like Jesus, Joseph, Solomon, ...
While there is a lot of similarities in the whole outline of the stories there are some serious contradictions in some details that make a big difference in the message that is conveyed to the reader while comparing Quran and Bibble.

I recommend reading Quran entirely for those who do religious researches.

I am not a fan of the Quran but for the sake of accuracy I would note that some insist that it has no contradictions citing reasons for various apparent contradictions. See the section on interpretation if you like.
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cach...ontradictions"+koran&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4&gl=us