A Tragic Mistake

[Mr. Shaman]

Discussing a topic with you becomes as convoluted as with that insane character that I mentioned several posts back.....

Here's another to consider.....much-more like TheFranklinParty...

 

[BigRob]

No offense but considering the source, I thank you for the compliment!

And thanks to you too ASPCA4.

One obvious problem with your post is you want to just make up laws to make a political statement. That is a joke.

 

[BigRob]

....But, somehow, you always manage....with nothin'!

Have you ever been diagnosed with masochistic/martyr-characteristics....'cause you surely do seem to enjoy being marginalized!!

​

Did you even read it? You support making up laws to make a political statement?

 

[Mr. Shaman]

One obvious problem with your post is you want to just make up laws to make a political statement. That is a joke.

....Much-the-way you make-up Factoids that've never (really) existed.

​

 

[BigRob]

....Much-the-way you make-up Factoids that've never (really) existed.

​

Such as?

 

[Sihouette]

One obvious problem with your post is you want to just make up laws to make a political statement. That is a joke~BigRob.

How so? Here, I'll repost it for your convenience in response here. Please cite exactly where I am allegedly "making up laws". I'd like to respond on case by case citation for purpose of this debate.

Look, no matter what, Obama knew going into any decision would be met with resounding criticism. His choice was one either hitting your thumb, your big toe or your kneecap with a hammer. No matter what, it's gonna sting afterwards. I suggest a fourth and less painful option: hitting Cheneyco on the head with a grand piano.

Very important to remember that if it weren't for Bush/Cheney trashing our world standing, Obama would not have to feel the pressure of trying to win at least one large world ally like India. The Brits, the Aussies and India...all the former British colonies including us and Canada. That's what has to come together ro reknit all that was lost on behalf of Cheneyco. That is why we are in Af/Pak.

Those stupid greedy fools will go down in history as some of the worst villians the US has ever known, in fact the world has ever known; considering how many have died as a direct result of their lies, machinations and greed. I still offer that we could win more allies by trying that regime in a world court with our full blessings of extradition than we'd ever get by snuggling up to India right now...spending more enlisteds' lives to accomplish less than what could be by raking those bastards through the coals.

The cat is out of the bag. Everyone knows that they are guilty and what they are guilty of: lying and killing for greed. Our negilgence in bringing them to justice is HUGELY undermining the thrust of our promises to our allies. As long as we harbor the moral equivalent of the nazi war criminals in Germany, we tell the world we are giving a silent assent, our nod to the atrocities committed.

Put yourselves in the shoes of our potential "enemies" like Iran, Russia and China. If we were them and were watching what the US is doing, we would be utterly DONE with the US and ready to topple it for the sheer pleasure of dethroning the worst malignant hypocrites. If we brought our war criminals to justice, we may not have warm fuzzies with these folks for many years, but at least the rebuilding of trust would start and a de-escalation of hostilities would be well underway. Imagine healthy trade and reducing arms instead of having to fall to our knees for other countries and beg for their charity? AND ALL THIS FOR ONE SMALL GROUP OF EVIL MEN who could easily be brought to justice for a tiny fraction of the expense of what we're commiting to now...on so many levels..

Basically we're screwed. We could send 100,000 troops today and every day for the next ten years and if they all died valiantly fighting for our honor, it still wouldn't make as much a difference as trying Cheneyco. Ironic that those responsible for plunging our economy on the brink of a national emergency now "require" us to plunge ourselves even closer to the brink in order to regain our national standing. The real hard decision that you're not hearing about is Obama wrestling with taking on these cutthroat bastards vs sending those who won't complain out to do janitorial work for India. That's the compromise I won't forgive him for. If you think about it, Michael Moore has more balls.

There's a cheaper way folks. So what if Tony Blair et al go down too? Make backroom deals, cover important names but by God bring a few token heads to roll. [Dick Cheney and "the Decider" for starters, and Blair] Cheneyco sacraficed so many fallguys and gals at the altar of greed and unjustly so. Why would we hesitate for a nanosecond to not do so with them in the name of world peace and prosperity

 

[BigRob]

How so? Here, I'll repost it for your convenience in response here. Please cite exactly where I am allegedly "making up laws". I'd like to respond on case by case citation for purpose of this debate.

Alright, here is the first one:

You keep going back to this point of "bringing them to justice", when talking about Bush, Cheney, etc... I assume somewhere in that statement you involve the court system correct?

What crimes are you going to charge them with? What laws are you going to assert they broke? No where do you mention anything like that.

You make vague arguments that they are guilty of "greed", but that is hardly illegal.

You then state, "Why would we hesitate for a nanosecond to not do so with them in the name of world peace and prosperity?" This is a pretty bold statement, since you claim we need to bring them to justice (but cite no laws that were broken). So essentially, you are saying, bring them to justice (based on personal opinions) to potentially gain more allies.

Personally, I find that argument absurd, but we will address that after the legal issues are addressed.

 

[TheFranklinParty]

Discussing a topic with you becomes as convoluted as with that insane character that I mentioned several posts back Do you obfuscate on purpose or are you totally unaware of the way in which you continually pull more fragmented items into ONE JUST ONE DISCUSSION
1. I didn't say our current Presidents AGE HAD ANYTHING to do with this topic
2. you keep referring to your list that covers a huge/wide variety of years
3. your list is also so filled with minuta of simplistic historic bumps and mental hiccups as to be laughable compared to the end of 2008 and the beginning of 2009...but I'll leave that to the historians to write it all up for you and then you'll be HAPPY!
4. your list is just that - YOUR LIST - so you feel like YOUR LIST MATTERS and I say it DOES NOT, that you aren't comparing apples to apples...but there I've said it again so that you may re-read it one more time!
5. But seriously...I believe you pretend at being obtuse on purpose!
Using words like: "almost killed and should have killed" doesn't make your point any stronger...nope not at all neither one of those examples were in any direct physical danger...JEEZ LOUSIE

I quote from your reply:

To which you typed up a list of Holocaust/mother nature events/incidents that track back before he was even born...WTH

You are clearly saying that I used events before he was born. This is why many of your arguments aren't taken seriously. You don't even remember what you type.

If you want to compare the difficulties of each of these individual years against 2009 then we have something to talk about, but it is your attitude that keeps anyone from having a level headed discussion with you.

I just don't see your point and that is OK. It is clear that you don't know what happened in those years, so I can't blame you for a lack of experience. You need to ask more questions and make less statements. That is how you will learn.

In 1968, there were several attempts on LBJ's life and by the end of the year some suggested he was close to a nervous breakdown. He watched 500 young men die in Vietnam each week. Yes, that's right, each week!! Robert Kennedy was assassinated, riots interrupted the Democratic convention and civil rights marches and desegregation almost started another civil war. People were literally dying in the streets.

Just the death toll in Vietnam alone and the challenge of keeping this country in one piece, IMHO, is more than our current President has had to deal with. By the way, the first healthcare reform was done while all this was going on.

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZNxpt141YYUS

FRANKLIN SAYS: I just don't see your point and that is OK. It is clear that you don't know what happened in those years, so I can't blame you for a lack of experience. You need to ask more questions and make less statements. That is how you will learn.

I sooo love it when you fall upon you own verbal PETARD...I couldn't have stated that any better...but wait...yes, I can

you just make me laugh with your constant obfuscating the topic into a weak arse history lesson that you seem to think that you are ALL KNOWING ABOUT. If sticking to the topic is such a mental struggle then just say so and walk away...HOLY BAT CRAP. You do a great 'DOG & PONY SHOW' but it just ends right back where I started: trying to get you to focus on the POINT.

I think Mr. Shaman has an unresolved issue on another thread that he's still waiting for your finite attention to answer...you seem to suffer from ADHD/ADD but that's OK, I deal with children that are similar to you every day

 

[Gipper]

I bet I could sell some of these to crazy libs everywhere...I think suppositories would sell better.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/12/02/crimesider/entry5864845.shtml?tag=cbsnewsSectionContent.3

 

[Sihouette]

You keep going back to this point of "bringing them to justice", when talking about Bush, Cheney, etc... I assume somewhere in that statement you involve the court system correct?

What crimes are you going to charge them with? What laws are you going to assert they broke? No where do you mention anything like that.~BigRob

Hmmm...I imagine a clever prosecutor who had evidence, say, that Cheneyco lied to Congress in order to start a war on the People's tab to assimiliate Iraq's oilfields for private enterprise and profit, and if said lies could be demonstrated to have led, via the titanic war costs to have helped place our nation in a position of strategic vulnerability via the recession at this critical hour...I'm thinking treason would apply too. In that sense greed would be illegal.

Barring that, I imagine that extradition to foreign courts could come up with some charges that would stick. Other nations have laws forbidding murder-for-profit, even if we don't. We owe it to the world to show them we are humble about Iraq and what was done there. If we don't, it could mean the end of the United States of America, and maybe even the planet if things get ugly enough...as they look like they're shaping up to be..

And all this for just a few greedy white guys that we're harboring. We demanded Hess et al in Germany. The world may demand this of us. What makes us the exception? Details please.

Its funny but your position of arguing subjective legality may wind up backfiring on Cheneyco in the end. It's all a matter in the end of how much good will be done in interpreting the laws to find for a guilty verdict.

 

[Sihouette]

*Waits for BigRob's reply*

 

[chestnut]

What's that old colloquial saying: 'you can make some of the people happy some of the time and most of the people happy most of the time...but you'll never make all of the people happy all of the time'

Never in my lifetime has any president faced the plethora of difficult decisions that we currently face; which does he ignore and stay focused upon, which does he cut and avoid because there isn't a SIMPLE/EASY way to fix it, which does he force upon those that don't want his options/plan, which does he cut the losses for and say it's time to just pull out and walk away

And I'm a huge cynic and I even knew that while our newly elected president made many a verbal promise while running for election...that when the finite inner workings were laid bare before his eyes that he might not be able to do all of those wonderful verbal promises that he clearly stated to each and everyone of us prior to January 2009.

The reality of the situation and the working details always seem to catch up the newly elected official and the things promised just don't come to fruition! I'm still hopeful and I'm still supportive...because I don't have nor do I know the answers to help him with the tough decisions that face him each & every day!

Oh No... Regan didn't have a huge mess after Carter did he?

 

[ASPCA4EVER]

Oh No... Regan didn't have a huge mess after Carter did he?

MATCH IT UP AGAINST WHAT WAS LEFT FROM G.W.B'S 8 YEARS AND LETS SEE THE COMPARISON...ITEM FOR ITEM

 

[Gipper]

MATCH IT UP AGAINST WHAT WAS LEFT FROM G.W.B'S 8 YEARS AND LETS SEE THE COMPARISON...ITEM FOR ITEM

It doesn't really matter because you are a true believer and facts will never change your opinion.

But how's this for starters?
1. Stagflation - look it up in the event you do not know what it is.
2. Iran Hostage Crisis - again look it up.
3. USSR on the move throughout the world due to Jimma's appeasement - well most Americans did not like this, but liberals did.

I know your response, these things were all meaningless and the evil doer Bush did much worse. Liberals ugh!!!