Inside the Koch World Convention

[David Hilbert]

Are we now just handing over our democracy to mega-millionaires? The mega-millionaire, Koch Brothers are holding what eerily looks like a convention of a political party of mega-millionaires to channel mega-million donations to right wing causes to defeat Obama. Has our democracy been lost to the interests of big money?

http://www.blogforarizona.com/blog/2012/06/koch-world-convention-for-the-corporatocracy.html

 

[dogtowner]

you say this like its not always been so ? govt is an invention of the powerful to more effectively seperate people from their money to expand their power.

 

[David Hilbert]

you say this like its not always been so ? govt is an invention of the powerful to more effectively seperate people from their money to expand their power.

But now, since CU, it's like the floodgates have been opened. At least, before CU, the rich and powerful worked behind the scenes, but now, they're, without any pride, doing it openly

 

[dogtowner]

But now, since CU, it's like the floodgates have been opened. At least, before CU, the rich and powerful worked behind the scenes, but now, they're, without any pride, doing it openly

its always been obvious if one was paying any attention at all, and if you want to highlight milestones then start with Lincoln as the first president to fully embrace it. took them a while to sort out a new way to govern post French Revolution but Marx gave them the framework to build on.

CU is a meaningless canard, really just dems whining that their union advantage was removed.

What you should be angry about is SCOTUS allowing giving money to equal free speech, thats the problem.

but remember that at the end of the day its individuals who pull the lever in the voting booth. people willing to sell their vote for walk around money will always exist as they understand it really doesnt make much difference which rich guys benefit. a little closer look shows that it makes a little difference if you are an achiever as opposed to a taker. dems rely on takers, gop on achievers.

 

[GenSeneca]

The Left is always pissing and moaning about American "democracy!" (even though we're a Constitutional Republic) when the results don't turn out the way they want. I'm sure David was wringing his hands and fearful for the state of our "democracy!" when Obama outspent McCain 5-1 in the '08 election...

As for CU, it leveled the playing field and took the unfair advantage away from the Unions. Dogtowner, money does equal free speech, the problem is that our government is allowed to use it's power to shower political favors on some at the expense of others, or punish some to the benefit of others... The Left is perfectly happy about that arrangement while they're in power but when they're the ones getting screwed for the benefit of someone else, then it's time to cry in front of the cameras and bemoan the death of "democracy!".

 

[Gipper]

Are we now just handing over our democracy to mega-millionaires? The mega-millionaire, Koch Brothers are holding what eerily looks like a convention of a political party of mega-millionaires to channel mega-million donations to right wing causes to defeat Obama. Has our democracy been lost to the interests of big money?

http://www.blogforarizona.com/blog/2012/06/koch-world-convention-for-the-corporatocracy.html

Yeah our democracy is dying, but not from what you suggest. We are handing it over to the Hollywood elite and the public sector unions.

Right?

 

[dogtowner]

The Left is always pissing and moaning about American "democracy!" (even though we're a Constitutional Republic) when the results don't turn out the way they want. I'm sure David was wringing his hands and fearful for the state of our "democracy!" when Obama outspent McCain 5-1 in the '08 election...

As for CU, it leveled the playing field and took the unfair advantage away from the Unions. Dogtowner, money does equal free speech, the problem is that our government is allowed to use it's power to shower political favors on some at the expense of others, or punish some to the benefit of others... The Left is perfectly happy about that arrangement while they're in power but when they're the ones getting screwed for the benefit of someone else, then it's time to cry in front of the cameras and bemoan the death of "democracy!".

absent the corruption aspect, govt is going to direct tax money somewhere so its normal for recipients to want to jockey for their spot at the row of teats. regarding the corruption, its particularly damning that Congress will allow all these exclusionary tactics but if you're going to call giving money away free speech then someone speaking more loudly will make this happen.

I understand the reasoning behind the free speech=$$$ but I don't accept it any more than I accept flag burning as such. I realize its just me.

the love of money is the root of all evil and boy do some love it.

 

[David Hilbert]

Yeah our democracy is dying, but not from what you suggest. We are handing it over to the Hollywood elite and the public sector unions.

Right?

The unions are spending less than 1/10th of what GOPper superPACs are spending. I don't think Hollywood can match them either

 

[Gipper]

The unions are spending less than 1/10th of what GOPper superPACs are spending. I don't think Hollywood can match them either

please provide proof of this assertion.

 

[GenSeneca]

absent the corruption aspect, govt is going to direct tax money somewhere so its normal for recipients to want to jockey for their spot at the row of teats.

The solution is to get rid of the milk. Take away government's power to tax one group in order to subsidize another and the special interests will have very little reason to spend any money on politics or political campaigns.

I understand the reasoning behind the free speech=$$$ but I don't accept it any more than I accept flag burning as such. I realize its just me.

So you don't agree with the concept of, "I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend to the death your right to say it"?

the love of money is the root of all evil and boy do some love it.

What an incredibly absurd thing to say... Money is the root of all evil... Ask yourself, what is the root of all money?

 

[GenSeneca]

please provide proof of this assertion.

Just more nonsense from the Left...

 

[David Hilbert]

The Left is always pissing and moaning about American "democracy!" (even though we're a Constitutional Republic) when the results don't turn out the way they want. I'm sure David was wringing his hands and fearful for the state of our "democracy!" when Obama outspent McCain 5-1 in the '08 election...

As for CU, it leveled the playing field and took the unfair advantage away from the Unions. Dogtowner, money does equal free speech, the problem is that our government is allowed to use it's power to shower political favors on some at the expense of others, or punish some to the benefit of others... The Left is perfectly happy about that arrangement while they're in power but when they're the ones getting screwed for the benefit of someone else, then it's time to cry in front of the cameras and bemoan the death of "democracy!".

In my extreme conservative period (during Reagan), I was a member of the John Birch Society and was given free stickers reading "this is a republic, not a democracy, let's keep it that way". Your post sure tells me you righties haven't changed agendas since then. We are certainly are a republic, but being so doesn't preclude our being a democracy too since our Constitution doesn't preclude it. You are just upset that money hasn't a louder voice and that the people might not be bought as easily as you wish

 

[GenSeneca]

Top All-Time Donors, 1989-2012

#1 on the list is solidly Democrat, of the first 18 biggest spending special interest groups not one leans Republican, you have to go down to #62 on the list before you get to one that's solidly Republican.

 

[GenSeneca]

You are just upset that money hasn't a louder voice and that the people might not be bought as easily as you wish

No, I'm upset that government abuses it's monopoly on the legal use of force to grant some people a benefit at the expense of others. We should all be treated equally under the law, government should protect the individual rights of every citizen equally, not violate the rights of some interest groups as a means of pandering to their own special interests.

 

[Gipper]

Just more nonsense from the Left...

Of course it is. Like much of what the Left believes...nothing but lies and misinformation. Sad. Very sad.

David Horowitz's new book outlines the TRUTH...

The book’s primary revelation is that conservatives are heavily outgunned when it comes to money. A third of the book is a series of appendices and tables that list foundations by assets and activist groups by budgets. These, and the story Mr. Horowitz and Mr. Laksinreveal, all add up to the reality that progressive foundations have about $105 billion in assets, a figure 10 times larger than the amount held by conservative foundations. Not one conservative foundation has assets exceeding $1 billion. Fourteen liberal foundations do. The money available to liberal activists dwarfs what conservative groups have access to.
This advantage means liberal groups far outspend conservative ones. On immigration, the 117 progressive groups identified by Mr. Horowitz and Mr. Laksin have 22 times the funding of the nine conservative groups. On environmental issues, the count is 553 liberal groups against 32 conservative ones, and the left has 462 times the funding of the right. A broad range of liberal groups thrive not because they have significant popular support, but because their big-donor funding stream is so massive and reliable.
This isn’t just a story of numbers. Mr. Horowitz and Mr. Laksin point out that much of this money is the diverted product of the free-market system progressives are trying to undermine. The left has employed a corps of philanthropic professionals to change the orientation of foundations established by capitalists. Oil tycoon J. Howard Pew, for instance, left a fortune to teach Americans the “values of the free market” and the “paralyzing effects of government controls.” Pew Charitable Trusts is now the largest funder of the Tides Center, a middleman funder of far-left-wing activists.