Politicians needs to do more to attract business to U.S.

chestnut

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2008
Messages
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We do not have a business climate that is very inviting to companies outside the U.S.

I don't understand why the politicians don't do the following.
  • Fair Tax - This would have many businesses clamoring to get in
  • Stop Cap & Tax legistation - by passing this - companies will leave the U.S.
  • Remove h/c legislation that penalizes business

If we are going to get back on track as a nation, our politicans need to take the steps to bring business to our shores and stop them from closing or leaving.
 
Werbung:
We do not have a business climate that is very inviting to companies outside the U.S.

I don't understand why the politicians don't do the following.
  • Fair Tax - This would have many businesses clamoring to get in
  • Stop Cap & Tax legistation - by passing this - companies will leave the U.S.
  • Remove h/c legislation that penalizes business

If we are going to get back on track as a nation, our politicans need to take the steps to bring business to our shores and stop them from closing or leaving.
Well, we already know that you know nothing about The Fair Tax.....how does Stop Cap & Tax legistation work??

Also, what're the details of Remove h/c legislation??

:confused:
 
I agree with Dr. Who...the less they do the better we will be.

The Fair Tax was created by people who couldn't pass the CPA exam. There are four major problems with this type of tax:

  1. It will burden all citizens with an extra 17%-24% tax on all goods. This burden will slow consumption and possibly put us into an economic tailspin.
  2. If you start to make exceptions then you begin the process of creating loopholes for those who don't deserve it.
  3. You have to send back checks to the lower income families every month. There is a 20% friction anytime money goes into the government. This means for every $1.00 that goes in only $0.80 comes out.
  4. Finally, as we have seen in other countries, this type of tax will create a massive black market, which will strengthen gangs and organized crime. If you don't think so, just look at how many people will buy something from the internet to avoid sales tax.
My suggestion is a very simple flat tax of 17.5% on earnings over $15K. In 2007, this would have covered the Discretionary Budget, which is what income tax is for according to the Constitution. You then move the corporate tax to 0% which re-patriots billions if not trillions of global national corporate profits.

The inevitable end would be a simple personal tax system that lowers the cost of living for citizen and a corporate tax structure that will bring back manufacturing and industry jobs to this country. IMHO
 
"You then move the corporate tax to 0% which re-patriots billions if not trillions of global national corporate profits."

Fortunately, smarter minds don't approve of your welfare program for corporations. If you examine what share of federal revenue comes from corporate taxes you wouldn't embarrass yourself with this absurdity.

If some industry can pay 9 cents an hour for labor in Bangledesh, they're not going to flock to America to pay decent wages.
 
We do not have a business climate that is very inviting to companies outside the U.S.

I don't understand why the politicians don't do the following.
  • Fair Tax - This would have many businesses clamoring to get in
  • Stop Cap & Tax legistation - by passing this - companies will leave the U.S.
  • Remove h/c legislation that penalizes business

If we are going to get back on track as a nation, our politicans need to take the steps to bring business to our shores and stop them from closing or leaving.

you forgot, in most other nations, they also don't pay for there workers health care.....
 
"You then move the corporate tax to 0% which re-patriots billions if not trillions of global national corporate profits."

Fortunately, smarter minds don't approve of your welfare program for corporations. If you examine what share of federal revenue comes from corporate taxes you wouldn't embarrass yourself with this absurdity.

If some industry can pay 9 cents an hour for labor in Bangledesh, they're not going to flock to America to pay decent wages.


Be careful about embarrassing statements. In 2007, corporations paid $400B of the $2T in revenues. That same year over $450B was not paid (illegally) by taxpayers. Another $500B was avoided through questionable and illegal tax practices. So, we could have had a 0% corporate tax rate and still had over $500B to spare if everyone would have paid what they owed.

Also, you need to get your head out of this cheap labor issue. That is a much smaller part of the reason jobs go oversees. The reality is the jobs you are describing, no one in the U.S. will do anyway. The real jobs that we are loosing in technology manufacturing and customer service would come back to the U.S., but the profits are in the other countries and can't be re-patrioted without incurring heavy taxation. So, they send the jobs there because that is where the profits are. When asked, CFO's of global companies have repeatedly said, they would rather bring the money back here and use it to expand manufacturing, R&D, and customer service.
 
Be careful about embarrassing statements. In 2007, corporations paid $400B of the $2T in revenues. That same year over $450B was not paid (illegally) by taxpayers. Another $500B was avoided through questionable and illegal tax practices. So, we could have had a 0% corporate tax rate and still had over $500B to spare if everyone would have paid what they owed.

Also, you need to get your head out of this cheap labor issue. That is a much smaller part of the reason jobs go oversees. The reality is the jobs you are describing, no one in the U.S. will do anyway. The real jobs that we are loosing in technology manufacturing and customer service would come back to the U.S., but the profits are in the other countries and can't be re-patrioted without incurring heavy taxation. So, they send the jobs there because that is where the profits are. When asked, CFO's of global companies have repeatedly said, they would rather bring the money back here and use it to expand manufacturing, R&D, and customer service.

Thousands of call center jobs went over seas, thousands of appliance jobs went over seas...Americans were dropped from those companies...so I'm thinking that you might be WRONG on that issue. Wasn't NAFTA a big part in the reasons that so many corporations started the relocation programs???
 
The Obama Admin came out yesterday 10/22/2009 and said the pokulous has had the maximum affect they sought and it's finished producing jobs. So the unemployment rate will get worse
from her on out!

Dr. Christina Romer’s testimony before the Joint Economic Committee. Citing economic analysts she says the fiscal stimulus will have its greatest impact on growth in the second and third quarters of 2009. (Editors note – those quarters are now behind us)

It's hard to believe they are acknowledging this now, but we told you so!

The Obama porkulous failed to produce jobs!
 
Right now we have probably 20 - 30 percent embedded tax in all the products we buy. That's built into the cost.

All the way down the supply chain. The payroll taxes and corp each of those links in the chain are that embedded tax.

If those taxes were eliminated by the Fair tax, the cost of those items would go down by that amount.

Then it would be paid as a national sales tax by those that consume products.
Each person would get a pre-bate of that sales tax for necessites.

Like any tax system, the loopholes would have to be closed, but, even as you suggest as a flat tax, exceptions could be made, which would nullify the whole system.

That's what's happening now.

Both need to be looked into further.

I know the folks who came up with the Fair Tax, spent millions on research and determined this system to be the best.

Here's one exceprt from the fairtax site:

"The FairTax is not politically viable"

The truth: Great public policy changes do not happen easily. We believe, however, in the promise of the Founding Fathers that this is a nation, "of, by and for the people". In the last year we have seen more Congressional co-sponsors come on board faster than ever before. We have seen five of eight GOP candidates and one Democratic candidate embrace the FairTax. With increased media coverage, as at least one candidate has made this a central plank of his campaign, more and more Americans have come to understand the powerful benefits the FairTax offers the nation. They are, in turn, joining our growing citizen army and are beginning to communicate their wishes to their elected officials. All of this progress is a consequence of the body politic first learning about and then accepting the FairTax. As our ranks grow such pressure will increase on Members of Congress and at some point, the voice of the people will eclipse the voices of the relatively small number of Washingtonians who profit working the income tax system at great cost to the nation. Enactment of the FairTax will require an activist citizenry and a resurgence of what has been too often forgotten--public policy can and should be driven by the public. All that is required is that we all dare to be fair and remind our elected officials that they work for their constituents--not for the narrow self-interests of the tax writing committee, the lucrative tax lobby business or the academicians who have built careers around the complexity of the tax code.

For more information on this topic, see these research papers:

Tax Administration and Collection Costs
A Macroeconomic Analysis of the FairTax Proposal
An Open Letter to the President, the Congress and the American People
Fiscal Federalism - The National FairTax and the States

"The FairTax is regressive and shifts the tax burden onto lower and middle income people"

The truth: The FairTax actually eliminates and reimburses all federal taxes for those below the poverty line. This is accomplished through the universal prebate and by eliminating the highly regressive FICA payroll tax. Today, low and moderate income Americans pay far more in FICA taxes than income taxes. Those spending at twice the poverty level pay a FairTax of only 11.5 percent -- a rate much lower than the income and payroll tax burden they bear today. Meanwhile, the wealthy pay the 23 percent retail sales tax on their retail purchases.

Under the federal income tax, slow economic growth and recessions have a disproportionately adverse impact on lower-income families. Breadwinners in these families are more likely to lose their jobs, are less likely to have the resources to weather bad economic times, and are more in need of the initial employment opportunities that a dynamic, growing economy provides. Retaining the present tax system makes economic progress needlessly slow and frustrates attempts at upward mobility through hard work and savings, thus harming low-income taxpayers the most.

In contrast, the FairTax dramatically improves economic growth and wage rates for all, but especially for lower-income families and individuals. In addition to receiving the monthly FairTax prebate, these taxpayers are freed from regressive payroll taxes, the federal income tax, and the compliance burdens associated with each. They pay no more business taxes hidden in the price of goods and services, and used goods are tax free.

How can the FairTax generate lower net tax rates for everyone and still pay for the same real government expenditures? The answer is two-fold. Firstly, the tax base is dramatically widened by including consumer spending from the underground economy (estimated at $1.5 trillion annually), and by including illegal immigrants, those who escape their fair share today through loopholes and gimmicks. In addition, 40 million foreign tourists a year will become American taxpayers as consumers here. Secondly, not everyone's average net tax burden falls. For households whose major economic resource is accumulated wealth, the FairTax will deliver a net tax hike compared to the current system.

Consider, for example, your typical billionaire, of which America now has more than 400. These fortunate few are invested primarily in equities on which they pay taxes at a 15 percent rate, whether their income comes in the form of capital gains or dividends. In addition to having the income from their wealth taxed at a low rate, the principal of their wealth is completely untaxed either directly or indirectly. Assuming they and their heirs spend only the income earned on the wealth each year, the tax rate today is 15 percent. In contrast, under the FairTax, the effective tax rate is 23 percent. Hence, the very wealthy will pay more taxes when the FairTax is enacted. In a nutshell, those who spend more will pay more but low, moderate and middle income taxpayers will benefit from the greatest gains in reduced tax liabilities.
 
Be careful about embarrassing statements. In 2007, corporations paid $400B of the $2T in revenues. That same year over $450B was not paid (illegally) by taxpayers. Another $500B was avoided through questionable and illegal tax practices. So, we could have had a 0% corporate tax rate and still had over $500B to spare if everyone would have paid what they owed.

Also, you need to get your head out of this cheap labor issue. That is a much smaller part of the reason jobs go oversees. The reality is the jobs you are describing, no one in the U.S. will do anyway. The real jobs that we are loosing in technology manufacturing and customer service would come back to the U.S., but the profits are in the other countries and can't be re-patrioted without incurring heavy taxation. So, they send the jobs there because that is where the profits are. When asked, CFO's of global companies have repeatedly said, they would rather bring the money back here and use it to expand manufacturing, R&D, and customer service.

Even if we didn't tax corporations, why would they create jobs in the US if there are foreign locales they can invest in where business development costs are lower, which would enhance their profits? Profit is the name of the game in business, no?
 
Right now we have probably 20 - 30 percent embedded tax in all the products we buy. That's built into the cost.

All the way down the supply chain. The payroll taxes and corp each of those links in the chain are that embedded tax.

If those taxes were eliminated by the Fair tax, the cost of those items would go down by that amount.

Then it would be paid as a national sales tax by those that consume products.
Each person would get a pre-bate of that sales tax for necessites.

Like any tax system, the loopholes would have to be closed, but, even as you suggest as a flat tax, exceptions could be made, which would nullify the whole system.

That's what's happening now.

Both need to be looked into further.

I know the folks who came up with the Fair Tax, spent millions on research and determined this system to be the best.

Here's one exceprt from the fairtax site:

"The FairTax is not politically viable"

The truth: Great public policy changes do not happen easily. We believe, however, in the promise of the Founding Fathers that this is a nation, "of, by and for the people". In the last year we have seen more Congressional co-sponsors come on board faster than ever before. We have seen five of eight GOP candidates and one Democratic candidate embrace the FairTax. With increased media coverage, as at least one candidate has made this a central plank of his campaign, more and more Americans have come to understand the powerful benefits the FairTax offers the nation. They are, in turn, joining our growing citizen army and are beginning to communicate their wishes to their elected officials. All of this progress is a consequence of the body politic first learning about and then accepting the FairTax. As our ranks grow such pressure will increase on Members of Congress and at some point, the voice of the people will eclipse the voices of the relatively small number of Washingtonians who profit working the income tax system at great cost to the nation. Enactment of the FairTax will require an activist citizenry and a resurgence of what has been too often forgotten--public policy can and should be driven by the public. All that is required is that we all dare to be fair and remind our elected officials that they work for their constituents--not for the narrow self-interests of the tax writing committee, the lucrative tax lobby business or the academicians who have built careers around the complexity of the tax code.

For more information on this topic, see these research papers:

Tax Administration and Collection Costs
A Macroeconomic Analysis of the FairTax Proposal
An Open Letter to the President, the Congress and the American People
Fiscal Federalism - The National FairTax and the States

"The FairTax is regressive and shifts the tax burden onto lower and middle income people"

The truth: The FairTax actually eliminates and reimburses all federal taxes for those below the poverty line. This is accomplished through the universal prebate and by eliminating the highly regressive FICA payroll tax. Today, low and moderate income Americans pay far more in FICA taxes than income taxes. Those spending at twice the poverty level pay a FairTax of only 11.5 percent -- a rate much lower than the income and payroll tax burden they bear today. Meanwhile, the wealthy pay the 23 percent retail sales tax on their retail purchases.

Under the federal income tax, slow economic growth and recessions have a disproportionately adverse impact on lower-income families. Breadwinners in these families are more likely to lose their jobs, are less likely to have the resources to weather bad economic times, and are more in need of the initial employment opportunities that a dynamic, growing economy provides. Retaining the present tax system makes economic progress needlessly slow and frustrates attempts at upward mobility through hard work and savings, thus harming low-income taxpayers the most.

In contrast, the FairTax dramatically improves economic growth and wage rates for all, but especially for lower-income families and individuals. In addition to receiving the monthly FairTax prebate, these taxpayers are freed from regressive payroll taxes, the federal income tax, and the compliance burdens associated with each. They pay no more business taxes hidden in the price of goods and services, and used goods are tax free.

How can the FairTax generate lower net tax rates for everyone and still pay for the same real government expenditures? The answer is two-fold. Firstly, the tax base is dramatically widened by including consumer spending from the underground economy (estimated at $1.5 trillion annually), and by including illegal immigrants, those who escape their fair share today through loopholes and gimmicks. In addition, 40 million foreign tourists a year will become American taxpayers as consumers here. Secondly, not everyone's average net tax burden falls. For households whose major economic resource is accumulated wealth, the FairTax will deliver a net tax hike compared to the current system.

Consider, for example, your typical billionaire, of which America now has more than 400. These fortunate few are invested primarily in equities on which they pay taxes at a 15 percent rate, whether their income comes in the form of capital gains or dividends. In addition to having the income from their wealth taxed at a low rate, the principal of their wealth is completely untaxed either directly or indirectly. Assuming they and their heirs spend only the income earned on the wealth each year, the tax rate today is 15 percent. In contrast, under the FairTax, the effective tax rate is 23 percent. Hence, the very wealthy will pay more taxes when the FairTax is enacted. In a nutshell, those who spend more will pay more but low, moderate and middle income taxpayers will benefit from the greatest gains in reduced tax liabilities.

The Fair Tax is a pipe dream, get over it. If millions were spent on research, then it was wasted. A few hundred on economics would have helped though.

Why the Fair Tax Won't Work by Bruce Bartlett
 
Even if we didn't tax corporations, why would they create jobs in the US if there are foreign locales they can invest in where business development costs are lower, which would enhance their profits? Profit is the name of the game in business, no?

How dare you question profits.....You Communist, socialist pinko. You sir are un-American...I question your patriotism...I question your actual birth in this country too. I think your a Muslim and not a CHRISTIAN which is worst then being an Atheist....You SIR ARE NOT HUMAN....you are associated with them Chicago Politicians that go around and put Floride in the drinking water and give H1N1 shots to the poor and unfortunate against their will(Although the Tea Baggers would support such a move as long as it's against Minorities and not white America unless their Liberals!!!) Always will have something to say about your evilness SIR!!!
 
How dare you question profits.....You Communist, socialist pinko. You sir are un-American...I question your patriotism...I question your actual birth in this country too. I think your a Muslim and not a CHRISTIAN which is worst then being an Atheist....You SIR ARE NOT HUMAN....you are associated with them Chicago Politicians that go around and put Floride in the drinking water and give H1N1 shots to the poor and unfortunate against their will(Although the Tea Baggers would support such a move as long as it's against Minorities and not white America unless their Liberals!!!) Always will have something to say about your evilness SIR!!!

I doubt it will be coherent.

Place your bets, place your bets...
 
Werbung:
I have read much misinformation in this thread. A few points:

1) No business pays corporate income tax. Their customers pay it. Either those are Americans, which means we don't avoid the tax like most people think, or its foreigners, which means we are taxing our imports - how boneheaded is that?

2) The FairTax does NOT rebate the tax for the poverty level to poor people. The FairTax rebates the tax up to the poverty level to EVERYBODY. That is, everyone gets a check for an amount that is 23% of the poverty level for that person's situation (single, married, married with X kids, etc.) all the way from your favorite street person up to Bill Gates himself. Everyone gets the rebate, or "prebate" as the FairTax people like to call it, since it's paid in advance.

3) Due to the aforementioned prebate, the FairTax is NOT regressive. In fact, the poor people benefit in 2 ways. First, they get a check from the gov't for that prebate amount. Second, they experience about a 22% lowering of prices for all the necessities of life that they buy up to poverty level spending. For example, a tomato that sold for $1 before the FairTax contained about 22% of its price as embedded income tax burden. After the FairTax, that 22% goes away, and the price of the tomato falls to $0.78. Then, the FairTax taxes it back up to about $1.01. But the poor person buying that tomato only pays $0.78 of his own money, and then reaches into his pocket for the "prebate" he received from the gov't, and pays the remaining $0.23 of the price with the prebate. IOW, the poor person experiences a price reduction of about 22%.

4) Everyone, but especially the poor, greatly benefit from the elimination of the very regressive medicare and social security taxes. These are 7.65% that comes out of the gross pay of the employee no matter if (s)he is making less than the poverty level or not. The employer also has to match this amount, and as we all know, businesses do not pay corporate taxes, their customers do.

5) The elimination of the 22% embedded corporate income tax on the price of all US-produced goods will greatly benefit US-manufacturers. For instance, a $25,000 Jeep Liberty, built in Toledo, Ohio, would have it's price fall to $19,500. The FairTax would tax it back up to slightly more than $25,000, but a foreign-made SUV that also costs $25,000 would receive no benefit from the elimination of corporate income tax on their manufacturing operations since they weren't paying US income tax in the 1st place. So, the price of the foreign SUV, in order to contain a 23% tax burden, would rise by about 30%, causing the price in the US to be about $32,500. US corporations, and especially US workers, would get a price advantage similar to a tariff, but without it being a tariff, and something that US workers have needed for decades.

6) The $25,000 Jeep Liberty mentioned in #5 above, that became priced at $19,500 without the embedded 22% corporate income tax, would actually be exported at $19,500. This would give US manufactured goods a great advantage on the world market, causing manufacturers to build many new manufacturing plants in the USA. This would be "bringing back the jobs" that the politicians like to say are "gone forever." They _are_ gone forever if we do not pass the FairTax, but if we do, we can get them back. Its no coincidence that US manufacturers and other businesses move overseas, such as to Ireland where the corporate taxes are 16%, or set up headquarters in some Caribbean island nations that have corporate income tax rates of 0%.

In short, we could say goodbye to this recession and unemployment virtually overnight if we could pass the FairTax. No more businesses closing US plants in favor of Mexico, Canada, or anywhere else - the US would be the newest, best tax haven on the planet. We can't lose with the FairTax - this is a win-win situation.
 
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