Question for people who like the Obamacare mandate

[dogtowner]

Oh, I'm always willing to help those in need. The thing is, you see, I'm not willing to allow deadbeats to ramp up the cost of medical insurance by going uninsured and then passing the costs on to the rest of us, as is currently happening.

If we're willing to just turn them out in the street, then we have no right to insist they have insurance.
If we're going to pay for the uninsured, then we have a right to insist that they have coverage.

yet another reason government should have never gotten into the medical biz.
unintended consequences and all.

 

[Cruella]

This trojan horse wasn't about people buying insurance. The deadbeats still won't buy it, I don't came how many laws they pass. What are they going to do? Put them in jail? Fine them? Refuse care in the emergency room? Yeah right.

 

[dogtowner]

This trojan horse wasn't about people buying insurance. The deadbeats still won't buy it, I don't came how many laws they pass. What are they going to do? Put them in jail? Fine them? Refuse care in the emergency room? Yeah right.

Yes, exactly. Refuse care ? Not without repealing some laws.

 

[Cruella]

Here is a new kink in the armor. This was written by a doctor;

"ObamaCare’s Independent Advisory Board and other regulatory committees and mandates will make it more and more difficult for doctors like me to practice and to order the tests and treatments we feel our patients need. We will require more staff hours to deal with all the red tape. As more of us drop out and no longer accept insurance, another unconstitutional mandate will become necessary to compel doctors to participate again."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/03/30/what-doctor-knows-about-obamacare/#ixzz1qelY6z00.

I bet there already is some sort of provision in Obamacare that prohibits doctors from excluding patients for any reason. My doctor has already had a sign on her counter for some time, that she will not even take Medicare patients. If we get an accute shortage of doctors, then what? Have them shipped in from China?

 

[dogtowner]

Here is a new kink in the armor. This was written by a doctor;

"ObamaCare’s Independent Advisory Board and other regulatory committees and mandates will make it more and more difficult for doctors like me to practice and to order the tests and treatments we feel our patients need. We will require more staff hours to deal with all the red tape. As more of us drop out and no longer accept insurance, another unconstitutional mandate will become necessary to compel doctors to participate again."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/03/30/what-doctor-knows-about-obamacare/#ixzz1qelY6z00.

I bet there already is some sort of provision in Obamacare that prohibits doctors from excluding patients for any reason. My doctor has already had a sign on her counter for some time, that she will not even take Medicare patients. If we get an accute shortage of doctors, then what? Have them shipped in from China?

Doc shortage is part of the package, great way to keep costs down and if they can't make it on the cash basis (its not as easy as it seems) and are forced to suck it up and work for peanuts imagine what happens to quality of care and throughput. All predictable as seen in other places where reward is subtracted.

I'm getting old so I don't care for myself but it pains me to think what my kid and future generations will have to accept as normal in light of what it could have been.

 

[Gipper]

The government has no right or business mandating that I buy a product just for existing... and the second I give them that power over me... GOD help us all.

Libs do not understand this or care.

 

[GenSeneca]

So, since we pay for their medical care, why can't we insist that they take care of their own needs and not be dependent on the rest of us?

The mandate does not solve that issue, you and I will still be forced to cover the expenses of others.

 

[Cruella]

So how did people survive all those years before medical insurance was even around? I think if they got lawyers out of the business of chasing ambulances and people could buy insurance to fit their needs, those things alone should reduce costs. And what communities having things like health clinics. Not for emergency patients, just for routine things like immunizations, blood tests, blood pressure checks etc. I bet doctors would even donate a few hours a month to such a clinic if the government and lawyers would just stay out of their business.

 

[dogtowner]

So how did people survive all those years before medical insurance was even around? I think if they got lawyers out of the business of chasing ambulances and people could buy insurance to fit their needs, those things alone should reduce costs. And what communities having things like health clinics. Not for emergency patients, just for routine things like immunizations, blood tests, blood pressure checks etc. I bet doctors would even donate a few hours a month to such a clinic if the government and lawyers would just stay out of their business.

medicine got very expensive when the government got into the medical biz.
pride was the only thing preventing needy people getting needed help before welfare.

government is the problem, not the answer.

 

[PLC1]

medicine got very expensive when the government got into the medical biz.
pride was the only thing preventing needy people getting needed help before welfare.

government is the problem, not the answer.

Moreover, medicine is more than just laudanum and leeches these days.

 

[dogtowner]

Moreover, medicine is more than just laudanum and leeches these days.

they were pretty much past using leeches and laudanum in 1965.
when people no longer kept track of what care cost, mysteriously care got a lot more costly.
you can argue advances if you want but the root cause is the disassociation of cost.

 

[PLC1]

they were pretty much past using leeches and laudanum in 1965.
when people no longer kept track of what care cost, mysteriously care got a lot more costly.
you can argue advances if you want but the root cause is the disassociation of cost.

That is indeed one of the root causes. So, how do we address that one?

 

[dogtowner]

That is indeed one of the root causes. So, how do we address that one?

its THE root cause, but to the query...

the path out starts with getting the government out of ther medical management biz and back to being a purchaser of health insurance (I want insurance gone as well but there is no realistic one fell swoop).

So Uncle Sam sits down with the insurance providers and negotiates what coverage there will be for the dollars available (yes, they have to decide just what that is and its two parallel operations for medicare and Medicaid). And get ready, its not going to be what exists today. Not going to say whether it will be better or worse but it will be different.

Now the next step comes as a result of the public furor which is to say people questioning why insurance in NY costs so much more than Montana and getting better uniformity of required coverages to effectively match what the people want in juxtaposition to what they want to pay.

Now we start re-applying market forces to the market. The health care biz will be up in arms as they will have to compete and Lord but they don't want that. Oddly enough that will be the toughest hurdle to clear. Even tougher than the government giving up "control".

Anyhoo thats a rough plan for a way out.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

I have to have Car insurance...I have to have homeowners insruance...and no one can say . well I just don't get sick...there is no way that you are not part of the market.

 

[PLC1]

its THE root cause, but to the query...

the path out starts with getting the government out of ther medical management biz and back to being a purchaser of health insurance (I want insurance gone as well but there is no realistic one fell swoop).

So Uncle Sam sits down with the insurance providers and negotiates what coverage there will be for the dollars available (yes, they have to decide just what that is and its two parallel operations for medicare and Medicaid). And get ready, its not going to be what exists today. Not going to say whether it will be better or worse but it will be different.

Now the next step comes as a result of the public furor which is to say people questioning why insurance in NY costs so much more than Montana and getting better uniformity of required coverages to effectively match what the people want in juxtaposition to what they want to pay.

Now we start re-applying market forces to the market. The health care biz will be up in arms as they will have to compete and Lord but they don't want that. Oddly enough that will be the toughest hurdle to clear. Even tougher than the government giving up "control".

Anyhoo thats a rough plan for a way out.

Isn't that the federal government solving the problem? It doesn't sound a whole lot different from "Obamacare"

and, don't insurance companies have to compete today? The idea that insurance can't be sold across state lines simply is not true. You do not have to buy insurance from a company that has an office in your state. Even if it were true, a big state like California would still have many companies competing for business.

I'd start with Medicare, and make a couple of changes:
Instead of paying 80% of nearly everything, as they do now, I'd pay on a sliding scale, starting with zero and going to 100%, depending on the total cost to the individual. We would all pay for basic care, in other words, but would get a helping hand if we had to have an expensive operation. Then, I'd gradually lower the age until everyone was covered by what would amount to a catastrophic cost insurance policy. Everyone would have medical care, yet the individual would have an incentive to control costs.

Not perfect, but far and away better than what we have now.