as of right now 2 dems have won in WI, 3 republicans..Dem leading last race

The point seems to be that you don't have the mental fortitude to recognize a gain for anyone who is not within your sphere of ideology.

What are you even talking about? The simple point is that there was NO gain. I can easily accept a gain on the part of the Democrats, but in this case, it didn't really happen. At the absolute most, you can maybe call it a draw, but it is quite the stretch to claim this is somehow good for Democrats.

It would be like in 2012 is the Republicans gained 2 seats in the US Senate. If I was running around calling that some fantastic victory, I would get laughed at, and I would deserve to get laughed at. Yes, it is a "gain", but it is completely meaningless. It offers R's no more say over what bills come up, it doesn't make any R's committee chairman, and it certainly doesn't mean R's are in control of anything.

I am pretty certain that, if the Republicans had retained all their seats, and the Democrats had lost their three seats, you would have taken that as a HUGE victory for Walker's stupid policies!

If you look at how the districts break down, there was about a 0% chance of that ever occurring, so really it is beside the point.

That said, if Democrats organized some massive recall, and it failed on all fronts, it would be a victory for Walker and the R's. Just like if Dem's had been able to retake the Senate, it would have been a big victory for the D's. But that didn't happen...a lot of money was spent, and nothing changed...if the status quo remains the same, the party in power before (and now still after) remains in control.

I really thought you had more fairness and integrity in you.

Apparently your definition of "fairness and integrity" is agreeing with your perspective....what a joke. :rolleyes:

The other point is that. . .we'll see what happens in 2012 in Wisconsin.

We will indeed see what happens in 2012...but trying to handicap 2012 based on this alone is quite simplistic.
 
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What are you even talking about? The simple point is that there was NO gain. I can easily accept a gain on the part of the Democrats, but in this case, it didn't really happen. At the absolute most, you can maybe call it a draw, but it is quite the stretch to claim this is somehow good for Democrats.

A draw? Well, I thought the Republicans lost two seats and the Democrats won two seats. . .Is that a draw? Sorry, I'm not into sport, so I may have a different idea of what a "draw" is.
But. . .getting into an election with 19/14 advantage, and coming out of it with a 17/16 advantage. . .doesn't really sound like a draw!


It would be like in 2012 is the Republicans gained 2 seats in the US Senate. If I was running around calling that some fantastic victory, I would get laughed at, and I would deserve to get laughed at. Yes, it is a "gain", but it is completely meaningless. It offers R's no more say over what bills come up, it doesn't make any R's committee chairman, and it certainly doesn't mean R's are in control of anything.

Who called it a "fantastic victory?" I believe I said it was a victory, mostly because it demonstrates a different outlook than the 2010 elections.

If you look at how the districts break down, there was about a 0% chance of that ever occurring, so really it is beside the point.

Funny. . .that's not exactly what was being said a week ago. . .there were high hopes that the Republicans would overcome the Dems in those district. . .this is in fact why I went and dug up this thread again.

That said, if Democrats organized some massive recall, and it failed on all fronts, it would be a victory for Walker and the R's. Just like if Dem's had been able to retake the Senate, it would have been a big victory for the D's. But that didn't happen...a lot of money was spent, and nothing changed...if the status quo remains the same, the party in power before (and now still after) remains in control.

No need to hurry. . .I think it's much better to let the Walker's policies to work their magic. . .let people experience it. . .let them fully realize the absurdity of it. Everything will come in its time.

Apparently your definition of "fairness and integrity" is agreeing with your perspective....what a joke. :rolleyes:

No, I obviously recognize the victory of the Republicans (at least the tea party Republicans) in the 2010 elections. . .But you would prefer to call this a "draw?" I wonder what would have happened if the roles had been reversed?

We will indeed see what happens in 2012...but trying to handicap 2012 based on this alone is quite simplistic.
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And this is why I do not predict the 2012 elections on this alone. I am talking about this small election showing a TREND, not a clear victory, not a complete prediction of future victory. . .just a TREND.

In the other hand, if this "little election" had gone the other way, and the Republicans had kept ALL their seats, and/or taken away the Dems' seats, I bet Fox News and quite a few people in this forum would have claimed it as a sure sign of things to come!
 
A draw? Well, I thought the Republicans lost two seats and the Democrats won two seats. . .Is that a draw? Sorry, I'm not into sport, so I may have a different idea of what a "draw" is.
But. . .getting into an election with 19/14 advantage, and coming out of it with a 17/16 advantage. . .doesn't really sound like a draw!

So I guess going into an election as the minority party, and coming out as the minority party sounds like a victory?

Who called it a "fantastic victory?" I believe I said it was a victory, mostly because it demonstrates a different outlook than the 2010 elections.

It demonstrates that in a localized election in Wisconsin that is focused on a single issue, the outcome is as we saw...other than that, I don't think it speaks at all to a national trend.

Funny. . .that's not exactly what was being said a week ago. . .there were high hopes that the Republicans would overcome the Dems in those district. . .this is in fact why I went and dug up this thread again.

After looking at those districts, it my professional opinion the people stating that are idiots. (unless there is some nuance to turnout for recall elections in Wisconsin)

No need to hurry. . .I think it's much better to let the Walker's policies to work their magic. . .let people experience it. . .let them fully realize the absurdity of it. Everything will come in its time.

Since most of the voters in Wisconsin do not work for the government, and are not members of a public union, I think you will find that political strategy a bit flawed.


No, I obviously recognize the victory of the Republicans (at least the tea party Republicans) in the 2010 elections. . .But you would prefer to call this a "draw?" I wonder what would have happened if the roles had been reversed?

I don't call it a draw, I call it a defeat for Democrats...at most you could argue it was a draw. If the roles were reversed I would say this was a defeat for the Republicans.

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And this is why I do not predict the 2012 elections on this alone. I am talking about this small election showing a TREND, not a clear victory, not a complete prediction of future victory. . .just a TREND. [/quote]

I am not sure you can really read too much into this based on my what I said above.

In the other hand, if this "little election" had gone the other way, and the Republicans had kept ALL their seats, and/or taken away the Dems' seats, I bet Fox News and quite a few people in this forum would have claimed it as a sure sign of things to come!

And they would no less wrong in that statement that when the roles are reversed.
 
So I guess going into an election as the minority party, and coming out as the minority party sounds like a victory?



It demonstrates that in a localized election in Wisconsin that is focused on a single issue, the outcome is as we saw...other than that, I don't think it speaks at all to a national trend.



After looking at those districts, it my professional opinion the people stating that are idiots. (unless there is some nuance to turnout for recall elections in Wisconsin)

I guess we will just agree to disagre. . . again!

But. . .I'm pretty happy with that "

Since most of the voters in Wisconsin do not work for the government, and are not members of a public union, I think you will find that political strategy a bit flawed.




I don't call it a draw, I call it a defeat for Democrats...at most you could argue it was a draw. If the roles were reversed I would say this was a defeat for the Republicans.
And this is why I do not predict the 2012 elections on this alone. I am talking about this small election showing a TREND, not a clear victory, not a complete prediction of future victory. . .just a TREND. [/quote]

I am not sure you can really read too much into this based on my what I said above.



And they would no less wrong in that statement that when the roles are reversed.[/QUOTE]

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. . .again!
But. . .I'm pretty happy with this "draw!" I hope there will be a lot more of that trend! ;):)
 
I see Rob, so going in with less seats then you had, and having lost 2 republican districts, and having it so now that just one Republican defection ( as they had already in the union vote). If the Union vote where held today, the fact is, it would have failed...

but in your eyes if the one party has 20 seats and the other 80...and there is a election and the side with 20 wins 29 seats...its a loss..even if you just gained 29 seats.

Republicans lost seats
Dems gained Seats

if that equals Republican victory here is to many many more.
 
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I see Rob, so going in with less seats then you had, and having lost 2 republican districts, and having it so now that just one Republican defection ( as they had already in the union vote). If the Union vote where held today, the fact is, it would have failed...

but in your eyes if the one party has 20 seats and the other 80...and there is a election and the side with 20 wins 29 seats...its a loss..even if you just gained 29 seats.

Republicans lost seats
Dems gained Seats

if that equals Republican victory here is to many many more.

Yes it is a loss. This is not some normal election, this was a recall effort orchestrated specifically to retake the majority and then repeal the bill they didn't like...something that didn't happen, and won't, happen.
 
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