Can you picture Jesus using genocide as Noah’s God did?

Gnostic Christian Bishop

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Can you picture Jesus using genocide as Noah’s God did?
The O.T. God has been described as the vilest God imaginable.
The N.T. shows Jesus as a much softer and gentler and loving God.
Many say that Jesus is God even though there are many who dispute that notion for a number of good reasons.
For this O P, I will assume that there is a Trinity. If you are a Trinitarian, then you would have to see the non-judgemental Jesus who would not even stone a prostitute, as the judgemental O.T. God of Noah’s day, --- who will even drown babies and children.
How do you reconcile the O.T. God with the kind, gentle and forgiving Jesus?
Some will point to a new covenant but God himself says that nothing he says will ever be retract and Jesus himself referred back to the old covenant in the bible so let’s not argue that please.
Can you picture Jesus doing the vile things that scriptures say he did in the O.T.?
Regards
DL
 
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Can you picture Jesus using genocide as Noah’s God did?
The O.T. God has been described as the vilest God imaginable.
The N.T. shows Jesus as a much softer and gentler and loving God.
Many say that Jesus is God even though there are many who dispute that notion for a number of good reasons.
For this O P, I will assume that there is a Trinity. If you are a Trinitarian, then you would have to see the non-judgemental Jesus who would not even stone a prostitute, as the judgemental O.T. God of Noah’s day, --- who will even drown babies and children.
How do you reconcile the O.T. God with the kind, gentle and forgiving Jesus?
Some will point to a new covenant but God himself says that nothing he says will ever be retract and Jesus himself referred back to the old covenant in the bible so let’s not argue that please.
Can you picture Jesus doing the vile things that scriptures say he did in the O.T.?
Regards
DL
If you were to read atheist's/Gnostic websites, you will often find complaints that the God of the Bible arbitrarily ordered the destruction of entire cities, such as Jericho, just to allow the Jews to have a homeland in the Middle East. How could a loving God command the destruction of all those "innocent" people? The argument sounds good, but it is utterly false. The unstated assumption is that the people who God ordered destroyed were morally equivalent to the Jews, who replaced them. However, this is what the Bible says about the people who were destroyed:
"It is not for your righteousness or for the uprightness of your heart that you are going to possess their land, but it is because of the wickedness of these nations that the LORD your God is driving them out before you, in order to confirm the oath which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. (Deuteronomy 9:5)
Okay, how "wicked" could those people have been? How about killing their own sons and daughters by burning them in sacrifices to their gods:

"You shall not behave thus toward the LORD your God, for every abominable act which the LORD hates they have done for their gods; for they even burn their sons and daughters in the fire to their gods. (Deuteronomy 12:31)

The wickedness of these people is confirmed in other verses of the Bible. So we see that these people are not quite as innocent as the atheists would like you to believe. The fact that these people practiced child sacrifice is also confirmed in the secular writings of the Greeks. Then again, maybe those atheists believe that killing your children is not all bad. After all, killing viable pre-born babies is legal in this country (it's called a choice, a.k.a. abortion). For these reasons (and others), God ordered the destruction of the peoples whom the Israelites dispossessed.
Did God kill any innocent people along with the evil ones? When God was about to destroy the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, Abraham asked God if He would destroy the cities if there were 50 righteous people in them. God said no. Then Abraham asked the same question if there were 45 righteous people. Every time he dropped the number and got the same answer. The fact is that God would not have destroyed those cities if there were any righteous people in them. The few righteous who were in those cities He warned ahead of time to get out. So, God does not destroy the righteous along with the evil.

God's judgment of people groups found in the Old Testament actually pales in comparison to the judgment He will render at the end of time. According to the New Testament Book of Revelation, God will judge and kill billions of people who reject Him when Jesus returns, including 200 million killed in a single battle. Such large armies have never existed in the history of mankind until the last 100 years, suggesting the this judgment could come at any time. I'm not saying its around the corner...Just saying..
 
What you and people like you would like us to believe that the God of the Old Testament just randomly killed people for no good reason and without warning. It turns out that you non-believers often don't present the entire stories about God's judgment. For example, in the greatest story of judgment, God sent a flood to kill all humanity except Noah and his family. However, Noah preached to the people of the coming judgment during the 100 years he was building the ark. In another famous example, God destroyed the cites of Sodom and Gomorrah, because of their evil. In fact, all the men of Sodom (including both young and old) attempted to rape the two angels who came to warn Lot of the impending judgment. Although warned, the men attempted to harm Lot, but were prevented when the angels caused them all to become blind. In many lesser known stories, God warned the people prior to executing judgment. Some of these warnings were heeded and others not, with the expected consequences. God's own people were often recipients of God's judgment, when they refused to heed His warnings. Here is a short list from the writings of the prophets:

Prophet.....................Warning .....................Result
Isaiah........................Judah ......................Judgment
Jeremiah...................Judah.........................Judgment
Lamentations............Jerusalem.................Judgment
EzekielJerusalem, Tyre, EgyptCaptivity in Babylon
Hosea.........................Israel........................ Judgment
JoelTyre, Sidon,.......... Philistia..................Judgment
Amos.............................Israel..................... Judgment
Obadiah.....................Edom...........................Judgment
Jonah.....................Nineveh...........................Repentance
Micah.......................Israel...............................Judgment
Nahum.......................Nineveh.......................Judgment
Habakkuk................Judah................................Judgment
Zephaniah.................Judah.............................Judgment
Zechariah.............Tyre, and other cities.............Judgment

It is a well known principle that God regularly warned people of impending judgment and He personally indicated that He would relent if they changed their ways. So, Your' idea that God killed people without warning is false.
 
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Gnostic..nothing you can say will change anything.. I have herd it all...

I am well aware that your mind is completely closed to logic and reason and have swallowed the notion that your prick of a God is somehow good.


I do not imagine that that clip will phase you but do you care to show your good morals?

If I were to say that Satan moved me to do evil or destroy people without cause, would you say I did evil?

If your God said the same, would your judgement be the same?

If you answer at all, then we will discuss morals.

If you do not answer then all will know that you cannot make moral decisions and that your religion has corrupted them.

This is good for me either way so I await your answer.

Regards
DL
 
Don't bring logic and reason into this

Only Christians can do that up until it starts to work against them and then it is disallowed

Everyone knows that slaughtering entire cities is fine

I wonder what the babies had done to deserve this?
 
I think I have replied to this before..
The God of the Bible is supposed to be both loving and all-powerful. Despite these characteristics, God seems to be unable or unwilling to prevent the vast amount of evil and suffering in the world. Why would God allow natural and moral evil into His creation? Are the skeptics correct in saying that a loving God would never allow evil to exist?

Why would God create an imperfect, temporary universe only to replace it later with a perfect one? Why wouldn't God have created a perfect universe in the first place? This is a good question, but shows a lack of understanding of the biblical reason of why God created the universe. One can find the reason for the creation of the universe in the first few chapters of the Bible. God created humans in order to have a personal relationship with them, which He had with Adam and Eve before they sinned (Genesis 2). Jesus said that the first and foremost commandment was to "Love the Lord your God..." A personal relationship, characterized by the possibility of love, is only possible if created beings are given free will. If God had created the universe with no possibility of evil or sin, then the created beings would have had no free will, and, as such, would essentially be programmed computers. Such beings would be incapable of love, since love involves making a choice - which requires the ability to choose not to love. For example, I can program my computer to say "I love you" when it starts up. Does this mean that the computer really loves me? Of course not! Likewise, God could have programmed humans to say that they loved Him, without the possibility of rejecting Him or performing evil deeds. However, these programmed beings would exhibit about as much true love as my computer - not a very satisfying relationship. Therefore, God created the universe for the express purpose of allowing free will spiritual beings the opportunity to have fellowship with Him (and likewise, reject Him).
Therefore. the Bible says that God allows temporary, bounded evil in order to allow free will beings to have the ability to love and to make choices. I am going to propose something which seems to support the atheists' arguments regarding evil. I agree that there is a lot of evil in the world. In fact, there is too much evil in the world from what would be expected from chaos theory or the laws of physics. Evolution does not explain the vast amount of evil done by mankind. None of the other creatures on our planet have the capacity for evil that mankind have. No other mammals kill arbitrarily. They only kill to eat and survive - but not mankind. Just watch the nightly news or read your newspaper. Look at all the evil perpetuated in the last century alone - 6 million Jews killed by Hitler, 40 million Russians killed by Stalin, 2 million Cambodians killed by their own government in the 1970's. In fact, the Pol Pot regime specifically preached atheism and sought to exterminate all religious expression in Cambodia. In addition to these atrocities, there have been hundreds of massacres committed in virtually every nation of the world. The Bible says that the presence of evil is due to the spiritual component of our nature - something that animals do not possess. God endowed His spiritual creatures (humans and angels) with free will to love God or to oppose Him. The most powerful created being (the angel Satan) rebelled and led one third of the angels into opposition against God. Those humans who oppose or ignore God follow Satan into rebellion - either consciously or unconsciously. Some people blame the evil on "society." However, society is composed of individuals who make individual choices. Most of the evil is committed by people who oppose the will of society. In contrast, there are many examples of societies in the animal kingdom, especially among the primates. None of these societies have the capacity for evil that we have.We are different from all other animals on our planet - a fact that has no scientific or evolutionary explanation
 
If god can't prevent the evil in the world he isn't all powerful

And if he doesn't want to he is not all good

Boom

And let us not forget that evil, the devil and wicked people didn't exist until god made them all the evil bastard

God is pure evil
 
I think I have replied to this before..
The God of the Bible is supposed to be both loving and all-powerful. Despite these characteristics, God seems to be unable or unwilling to prevent the vast amount of evil and suffering in the world. Why would God allow natural and moral evil into His creation? Are the skeptics correct in saying that a loving God would never allow evil to exist?

Why would God create an imperfect, temporary universe only to replace it later with a perfect one? Why wouldn't God have created a perfect universe in the first place? This is a good question, but shows a lack of understanding of the biblical reason of why God created the universe. One can find the reason for the creation of the universe in the first few chapters of the Bible. God created humans in order to have a personal relationship with them, which He had with Adam and Eve before they sinned (Genesis 2). Jesus said that the first and foremost commandment was to "Love the Lord your God..." A personal relationship, characterized by the possibility of love, is only possible if created beings are given free will. If God had created the universe with no possibility of evil or sin, then the created beings would have had no free will, and, as such, would essentially be programmed computers. Such beings would be incapable of love, since love involves making a choice - which requires the ability to choose not to love. For example, I can program my computer to say "I love you" when it starts up. Does this mean that the computer really loves me? Of course not! Likewise, God could have programmed humans to say that they loved Him, without the possibility of rejecting Him or performing evil deeds. However, these programmed beings would exhibit about as much true love as my computer - not a very satisfying relationship. Therefore, God created the universe for the express purpose of allowing free will spiritual beings the opportunity to have fellowship with Him (and likewise, reject Him).
Therefore. the Bible says that God allows temporary, bounded evil in order to allow free will beings to have the ability to love and to make choices. I am going to propose something which seems to support the atheists' arguments regarding evil. I agree that there is a lot of evil in the world. In fact, there is too much evil in the world from what would be expected from chaos theory or the laws of physics. Evolution does not explain the vast amount of evil done by mankind. None of the other creatures on our planet have the capacity for evil that mankind have. No other mammals kill arbitrarily. They only kill to eat and survive - but not mankind. Just watch the nightly news or read your newspaper. Look at all the evil perpetuated in the last century alone - 6 million Jews killed by Hitler, 40 million Russians killed by Stalin, 2 million Cambodians killed by their own government in the 1970's. In fact, the Pol Pot regime specifically preached atheism and sought to exterminate all religious expression in Cambodia. In addition to these atrocities, there have been hundreds of massacres committed in virtually every nation of the world. The Bible says that the presence of evil is due to the spiritual component of our nature - something that animals do not possess. God endowed His spiritual creatures (humans and angels) with free will to love God or to oppose Him. The most powerful created being (the angel Satan) rebelled and led one third of the angels into opposition against God. Those humans who oppose or ignore God follow Satan into rebellion - either consciously or unconsciously. Some people blame the evil on "society." However, society is composed of individuals who make individual choices. Most of the evil is committed by people who oppose the will of society. In contrast, there are many examples of societies in the animal kingdom, especially among the primates. None of these societies have the capacity for evil that we have.We are different from all other animals on our planet - a fact that has no scientific or evolutionary explanation

Hogwash.
Can you help but do evil? I do not see how. Do you?
And if you cannot, why would God punish you?
Christians are always trying to absolve God of moral culpability in the fall by putting forward their free will argument and placing all the blame on mankind.
That usually sounds like ----God gave us free will and it was our free willed choices that caused our fall. Hence God is not blameworthy. Such statements simply avoid God's culpability as the author and creator of human nature.
Free will is only the ability to choose. It is not an explanation why anyone would want to choose "A" or "B" (bad or good action). An explanation for why Eve would even have the nature of "being vulnerable to being easily swayed by a serpent" and "desiring to eat a forbidden fruit" must lie in the nature God gave Eve in the first place. Hence God is culpable for deliberately making humans with a nature-inclined-to-fall, and "free will" means nothing as a response to this problem.
If all do evil/sin by nature then, the evil/sin nature is dominant. If not, we would have at least some who would not do evil/sin. Can we then help but do evil? I do not see how. Do you?
Having said the above for the God that I do not believe in, I am a Gnostic Christian naturalist, let me tell you that evil and sin is all human generated and in this sense, I agree with Christians, but for completely different reasons. Evil is mankind’s responsibility and not some imaginary God’s. Free will is something that can only be taken. Free will cannot be given not even by a God unless it has been forcibly withheld.
Much has been written to explain evil and sin but I see as a natural part of evolution.
Consider.
First, let us eliminate what some see as evil. Natural disasters. These are unthinking occurrences and are neither good nor evil. There is no intent to do evil even as victims are created. Without intent to do evil, no act should be called evil.
In secular courts, this is called mens rea. Latin for an evil mind or intent and without it, the court will not find someone guilty even if they know that they are the perpetrator of the act.
Evil then is only human to human when they know they are doing evil and intend harm.
As evolving creatures, all we ever do, and ever can do, is compete or cooperate.
Cooperation we would see as good as there are no victims created. Competition would be seen as evil as it creates a victim. We all are either cooperating, doing good, or competing, doing evil, at all times.
Without us doing some of both, we would likely go extinct.
This, to me, explains why there is evil in the world quite well.
Be you a believer in nature, evolution or God, you should see that what Christians see as something to blame, evil, we should see that what we have, competition, deserves a huge thanks for being available to us. Wherever it came from, God or nature, without evolution we would go extinct. We must do good and evil.
There is no conflict between nature and God on this issue. This is how things are and should be. We all must do what some will think is evil as we compete and create losers to this competition.
These links speak to theistic evolution.
If theistic evolution is true, then the myth of Eden should be read as a myth and there is not really any original sin.
If the above is not convincing enough for you then show me where in this baby evil lives or is a part of it’s nature and instincts.
Can you help but do evil? I do not see how. Do you?
And if you cannot, why would God punish you?
Regards
DL
 
If god can't prevent the evil in the world he isn't all powerful

And if he doesn't want to he is not all good

Boom

And let us not forget that evil, the devil and wicked people didn't exist until god made them all the evil bastard

God is pure evil

If in the beginning there was only God, all the evil that is emanated from him. It had to.

Regards
DL
 
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