Ecofascist Disasters

[Libsmasher]

So people are starving all over the world because of the ecolunatic notion of substituting food for fuel? That's a warning - what further disasters await us if more ignorant zealous envirnomentalists gain power? (Obama comes to mind.)

 

[Coyote]

So people are starving all over the world because of the ecolunatic notion of substituting food for fuel? That's a warning - what further disasters await us if more ignorant zealous envirnomentalists gain power? (Obama comes to mind.)

Just to put this back into a more realistic view - this is another example of "unintended consequences" caused by "ecofascists" partnered with "capitalofascists". An unholy union of left and right creating greed and disaster.

 

[Andy]

Just to put this back into a more realistic view - this is another example of "unintended consequences" caused by "ecofascists" partnered with "capitalofascists". An unholy union of left and right creating greed and disaster.

Everyone is a capitalist. Capitalism and fascism is almost mutually exclusive. Capitalism is the belief in free market, and individual ability to improve ones self. It partners with the belief that government should have no, or minimal, controls. Is it any wonder that one of the biggest supporters and benefiters of the Ethanol subsidies is Ted Tuner, a hard leftist supporter of big government, that takes an anti-capitalist stand despite being one himself?

As far as eco-fascists are concerned.. I don't actually believe it's unintended. I think most know their communistic/socialist systems do not work, but since it benefits them, they support it knowing it will gain them more power. Al Gore knows one thing for certain, he makes millions off eco-nut propaganda, both in the millions he makes traveling around giving lame unsupported save the planet speeches, and in carbon credit policies he has invested interest in.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

blaming biofuels for the fact some people don't have food is just dumb. People did not food 10 years ago or 20 as well....its a combination of Droughts hitting some areas very hard, Basic economics ( aka the nation has no money anyway) the food can't get to the areas, and leaders who squander food and aid on other things. There is plenty of food, its distribution that keeps it from some. Last I checked went to Cub and still shelves full of food. my Food bill for a few weeks food was like 40 bucks ( aka not even one tank of gas) oddly not much more then 10 years ago when I went and got food. My gas at that time was less then a buck at times. There is a lot of tech going into making foods that don't grow in bad areas, work , and getting poor areas foods that actually will grow well for them. Also new types of Bio Fuel , like Switchgrass ( one of those some things are right even if Bush says them things) and other non food item fuels.

I am sure you would be yelling that its liberals who are keeping fuel from the poor if we did not, or something on those lines. I swear your Right wing hacks sound more and more like Cry baby hippies , just so you can attack the left. Odd how things have changed.

 

[Libsmasher]

Just to put this back into a more realistic view - this is another example of "unintended consequences" caused by "ecofascists" partnered with "capitalofascists". An unholy union of left and right creating greed and disaster.

Capitalists, my ass. Not a drop of ethanol would ever have been created in the US if it were just up to capitalists.

 

[Libsmasher]

blaming biofuels for the fact some people don't have food is just dumb. People did not food 10 years ago or 20 as well....its a combination of Droughts hitting some areas very hard, Basic economics ( aka the nation has no money anyway) the food can't get to the areas, and leaders who squander food and aid on other things. There is plenty of food, its distribution that keeps it from some. Last I checked went to Cub and still shelves full of food. my Food bill for a few weeks food was like 40 bucks ( aka not even one tank of gas) oddly not much more then 10 years ago when I went and got food. My gas at that time was less then a buck at times. There is a lot of tech going into making foods that don't grow in bad areas, work , and getting poor areas foods that actually will grow well for them. Also new types of Bio Fuel , like Switchgrass ( one of those some things are right even if Bush says them things) and other non food item fuels.

I am sure you would be yelling that its liberals who are keeping fuel from the poor if we did not, or something on those lines. I swear your Right wing hacks sound more and more like Cry baby hippies , just so you can attack the left. Odd how things have changed.

Libs never want to own up to the destruction they create. 28% of the corn acreage in the US, one of the worlds great grain growing regions, into ethanol, and it hasn't had an effect? Yaa, sure. The price of food in the groceries I go to are up about double in the past three years, depending on grain content.

 

[Bunz]

Libs never want to own up to the destruction they create. 28% of the corn acreage in the US, one of the worlds great grain growing regions, into ethanol, and it hasn't had an effect? Yaa, sure. The price of food in the groceries I go to are up about double in the past three years, depending on grain content.

I think you are mistaken. It is the right and thier corporate puppet masters that have caused untold enviromental disasters and will only resond when demanded to do so, they will do everything in thier power to avoid cleaning up the mess themselves and fight every nickel and dime in those efforts. Then the tax payers are forced to step in.

A quick list from modern times.
Exxon Valdez
Picher Oklahoma
Berkeley Pit mine in Montana

 

[Libsmasher]

I think you are mistaken. It is the right and thier corporate puppet masters that have caused untold enviromental disasters and will only resond when demanded to do so, they will do everything in thier power to avoid cleaning up the mess themselves and fight every nickel and dime in those efforts. Then the tax payers are forced to step in.

A quick list from modern times.
Exxon Valdez
Picher Oklahoma
Berkeley Pit mine in Montana

The well-publicized screw-ups of corporations aren't within orders of magnitude of what was created in the east bloc. When the russians got out of eastern europe, a vast ecological wasteland was revealed. Ever heard of Chernobyl? Gray = "no fallout":

 

[Pidgey]

Just to put this back into a more realistic view - this is another example of "unintended consequences" caused by "ecofascists" partnered with "capitalofascists". An unholy union of left and right creating greed and disaster.

I thought we wanted a "uniter, not a divider" in the White House?

Pidgey

 

[foggedinn]

Capitalists, my ass. Not a drop of ethanol would ever have been created in the US if it were just up to capitalists.

I agree. It's not a capitalist issue, or a left/right issue. As near as I can tell, it's a matter of special interests overcoming common sense.

For fourty years I've been listening to politcians of both parties badmouth the annual farm bills that everyone agrees creat artificial imbalances. Yet year after year we do exactly the same things. Year after year, everyone but the farmers agree what a stupid bill we just passed, and the next year we pass another one just like it.

I really don't understand how anyone could see this as a left/right issue. Perhaps it's just human nature to see those whom we perceive as our political opponents, as the cause of all problems.

 

[Bunz]

The well-publicized screw-ups of corporations aren't within orders of magnitude of what was created in the east bloc. When the russians got out of eastern europe, a vast ecological wasteland was revealed. Ever heard of Chernobyl? Gray = "no fallout":

I live in Alaska, not on the moon. Of course I know about Chernobyl. There was concern that some of that fallout came over the pole and landed in Alaska. But you really are comparing apples and oranges IMHO. One will only know what horrors will be unveiled when China opens more.

 

[Bunz]

I agree. It's not a capitalist issue, or a left/right issue. As near as I can tell, it's a matter of special interests overcoming common sense.

I would agree, but Libsmasher who you quote in your statement went on to blame liberals for the ills of ethanol. But then again, my republican zealot friend wants to blame all the ills of the world in "libs"

 

[Pidgey]

I would agree, but Libsmasher who you quote in your statement went on to blame liberals for the ills of ethanol. But then again, my republican zealot friend wants to blame all the ills of the world in "libs"

Well, Bunz, let's be fair... judging by your signature:

"You Can't Drink All Day If You Don't Start In The Morning. "

...you believe heartily in ethanol, you just don't want to waste it in a car!

Pidgey

 

[Bunz]

Well, Bunz, let's be fair... judging by your signature:

"You Can't Drink All Day If You Don't Start In The Morning. "

...you believe heartily in ethanol, you just don't want to waste it in a car!

Pidgey

That had me laugh. Good one. I am left leaning and care about the enviroment and despise the poor stewardship multinational corps practice.
I dont care as long as it doesnt effect the production of beer.

 

[Coyote]

I agree. It's not a capitalist issue, or a left/right issue. As near as I can tell, it's a matter of special interests overcoming common sense.

Pretty much that is what it is despite the efforts of some to paint it as a left/right "eco-nuts" issue.

The problem is - unintended consequences. Who would have guessed that the push for biofuels (a push in this country fueled by agricultural corn interests - a very powerful interest group) would have the repercussions in the food markets - particularly those of poor countries who depend on cheap corn for much of their food needs? Add to that - the price of grain increases the price of other products dependent on grain such as beef.

Part of the problem is that corn is not the ony viable source for biofuels. Sugar beets (I think...or maybe sugar cane...) is considered as good and there are possibilities in grasses and garbage. But none of those have the big bucks power of the corn special interest groups.