Before talking to your last post saggyjones, I'd like to reply to one thing you wrote to nospam.
Sending them back is not working primarily because of the intentional porousness of the border. And we can't kid ourselves ...it IS certainly porous by design.
Now to me, you wrote,
Actually, it does increase the probability that someone can get health insurance, because they're legal. I'm not saying it guarantees it though.
I wrote that it doesn't INDICATE
a probability, and I'll stand by that:
A person making $5.15 an hour as a legal US citizen is no more likely to buy health insurance
than a person making $5.15 an hour as an illegal immigrant, unless that person is able to get food and a roof over their head for free. It is even less likely if that person is taking care of other people besides themself, which is so often the case with those who have come across the southern border.
People who argue that illegals put a strain on health care don't realize that making them legal will allow them to pay taxes and possibly get health insurance. That means that legalizing the ones here now will actually benefit the health care system.
Just what I live for ...benefits to HMOs !
That's why we need to tighten border security. Also, the president would explain why he was legalizing them, and that any new illegals found would be sent back immediately.
In your prior post you made the argument to nospam that sending them back IS NOT WORKING
. Why would it suddenly be workable to do so after another amnesty ?
Exactly. Now those companies are forced to compete which is good for the economy as a whole, and the immigrants are allowed decent lives. Also it allows regular citizens to compete for the jobs, which eliminates the problem of illegals taking our jobs.
This completely ignores the stresses created by flooding the market with low skilled workers, even if they all can command the same wage after the amnesty.
Second, as far as "decent lives", please consider this:
The people who breech the southern border are NOT
the poorest people in Mexico, El Salvador, Honduras, and other such places. The poorest cannot afford the trip or to pay the coyotes.
The people who enter the US this way correspond to our lower middle class. This was documented in an extended study which you can access on the CIS website.
Most commonly these people had jobs in their home country and were far from desperate; the lure was irresistible though, of coming here and making $5 an hour vs. 50 cents an hour ...
especially thanks to NAFTA's having upset their entire economy.
Both Dems and Repubs were pro NAFTA at the time (early 1990s) and so were the leaders of Mexico. Do we begin to see a pattern ?
In any case, the picture is of a (relative) lower middle class from a country far wealthier than many other countries, migrating to the US.
The people there who MOST
need their lives to be more decent ...are stuck there.
The way to improve things in Latin America is for the people to overthrow their corrupt governments, where many billionaires hoard resources.
If the people of Cuba and Venezuela can do it, then the others can too - and would, if there were not this easy way out by sneaking into the US and then being granted amnesty.
Exactly. How does this support your argument?
Apparently you didn't catch the "ones here now" part. I only support legalizing the illegal immigrants here now; new ones after we crack down on border security should be sent back.
The "ones here now" have ALSO bypassed screening for infectious disease and history of violent crime -
which probably explains the inflated percentages of violent crime and multi drug resistant TB, Chigas disease, and even leprosy among them - being battled with our tax dollars.
And again I would ask you why you think the "sending back" strategy would suddenly become effective AFTER granting amnesty.
Granting legal citizenship to people who flouted the law is a slap in the face to everyone who waited their turn, filled out papers, underwent the screening and did it the way we stipulated.
Thanks, it was a fun evening.
There is one more thing I wanted to add on this topic:
You wrote something to a poster above about immigrant farm workers, and how we have to eat and stuff.
Please note that seasonal farm work is addressed under separate legislation and has little to do with the huge numbers of illegal immigrants employed in industries such as slaughterhouses, packing plants, and the like.