Biden collusion with Russia

[Phoenix68]

Did I misunderstand him? I thought he said EU officials complained to him that the prosecution of Burisma was going nowhere and needed someone like him to go to Ukraine and fire the prosecutor that was slowing the criminal proceedings down.

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No...you don't think. You merely regurgitate whatever horseshit that sounds like something you Believe.
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[mark francis]

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View attachment 6835
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No...you don't think. You merely regurgitate whatever horseshit that sounds like something you Believe.
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Let me get this straight. Did Biden go to Ukraine in 2016 to jump start a stalled investigation or did he go there to shut the investigation down completely? Guess what happened after Biden strongarmed Ukraine into firing the prosecutor who had just seized Burisma assets the week before?

 

[Ai guy]

You should expect strong efforts by crooks to cover their crime and corruption. Manafort was brutally arrested by unnecessary force for doing business with a company that did business with Turkey and he was charged with a FARA violation, which was a serious stretch, especially since Americans are rarely charged with such violations. Hunter Biden, for example, has done direct business, not third party like Manafort, with several foreign nations and has not ever registered as he was supposed to under FARA.

The argument presented contains several claims and assumptions that need to be addressed individually:

1. "You should expect strong efforts by crooks to cover their crime and corruption."
   • What 'crooks' might you be referring to? If you assume it is Joe Biden, you'll need to substantiate that claim.
2. "Manafort was brutally arrested by unnecessary force..."
   • The characterization of Paul Manafort's arrest as "brutal" and with "unnecessary force" is subjective and not universally accepted. It's important to rely on factual accounts and evidence when discussing the nature of an arrest.
3. "...for doing business with a company that did business with Turkey and he was charged with a FARA violation..."
   • Paul Manafort was charged with multiple counts, including tax fraud, bank fraud, and failing to disclose foreign bank accounts. The charges were not solely based on a FARA (Foreign Agents Registration Act) violation. Moreover, his charges were related to his work for pro-Russian politicians in Ukraine, not just for doing business with a company that had ties to Turkey. Note that the DOJ would rarely charge a high value target for FARA alone, but they will add it to other more serious charges being filed.
4. "...especially since Americans are rarely charged with such violations."
   • See above
5. "Hunter Biden, for example, has done direct business, not third party like Manafort, with several foreign nations and has not ever registered as he was supposed to under FARA."
   • This claim contains several assumptions:
     • First, doing business with foreign nations is not, in itself, a FARA violation. FARA requires individuals to register if they are acting as agents of foreign principals in a political or quasi-political capacity. Simply doing business does not automatically necessitate FARA registration.
     • Second, the comparison between Manafort and Hunter Biden is not entirely apples-to-apples. Manafort's charges were related to his political consulting in Ukraine and his failure to disclose those activities, while the nature of Hunter Biden's business dealings is different.
     • Lastly, any allegations or suspicions about Hunter Biden would need to be thoroughly investigated and proven in a court of law, just like any other individual.

In summary, while the argument raises concerns about consistency in law enforcement, it's essential to approach each case individually, relying on evidence and facts rather than generalizations or assumptions. In other words, your argument fails for lack of substantiation.

 

[Ai guy]

The proof is not in looking at the pudding but in the eating of the pudding. Biden went to Ukraine talking about how he was going to force that nation to speed up their prosecutions of Burisma and its officers, including Hunter Biden, but that is not what he did. The undeniable fact remains that instead of speeding up the investigation the result of Biden's injection into the situation was that the ivestigation was shut down completely.

The article discusses the controversy surrounding the firing of Viktor Shokin, Ukraine's prosecutor-general, in March 2016 and its implications in U.S. politics, particularly concerning President Donald Trump and former Vice President Joe Biden.

Key Points:

1. Viktor Shokin's Dismissal: Shokin was fired as Ukraine's prosecutor-general in March 2016, a move seen as a significant step for a country trying to combat corruption. This event later became central to political debates in Washington, affecting Trump's presidency and the 2020 White House race.
2. Accusations Against Biden: Trump and his allies, including his personal lawyer Rudolph Giuliani, allege that Biden used his position as vice president to protect Burisma, a Ukrainian energy company where his son, Hunter Biden, was a board member, from a criminal investigation. They claim Biden threatened to withhold $1 billion in loan guarantees to Ukraine unless Shokin was fired.
3. Counterarguments: Ukrainian prosecutors and anti-corruption activists dispute this narrative. They argue that the timeline doesn't support Trump's claims and that Shokin was actually hindering the investigation into Burisma. Daria Kaleniuk, from the Anti-Corruption Action Center, stated that Shokin had abandoned significant corruption investigations, including the one into Burisma.
4. Trump-Zelenskiy Phone Call: Reports suggest Trump pressured Ukraine's new president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, during a July 25 phone call to investigate the Bidens. This call became central to a whistle-blower complaint from a U.S. intelligence official.
5. Question of Pressure: Activists and officials in Ukraine argue that the investigation into Burisma's owner, Mykola Zlochevskiy, had been dormant long before Biden's alleged threat. They claim Shokin himself had sabotaged the case. Kaleniuk emphasized that Biden wanted Shokin out because he wasn't pursuing the Burisma case, not because he was actively investigating it.
6. Support for Shokin's Dismissal: Many Western organizations, governments, diplomats, and Ukrainian anti-corruption groups had called for Shokin's firing, including the International Monetary Fund, the European Union, and the U.S. government. They criticized Shokin for damaging Ukraine's legal system.
7. Burisma's Donation: An annual report revealed that Burisma donated between $100,000 and $250,000 to the Atlantic Council in 2018-19.

In summary, the article delves into the controversy surrounding Shokin's firing and its implications in U.S. politics, with Trump and his allies accusing Biden of wrongdoing, while Ukrainian officials and activists counter these claims. The situation has further complicated U.S.-Ukraine relations and has implications for the 2020 U.S. presidential race.


Does the article prove your claim IMPLIED (which appears to allude to some kind of wrongdoing by Biden) in your headline?

Your article does not prove any corruption or illegal activity by Joe Biden. It presents arguments and evidence from both sides of the dispute regarding Joe Biden's involvement in the firing of Ukraine's top prosecutor. Trump and his allies accuse Biden of pressuring Ukraine to fire the prosecutor to protect his son, who was on the board of a Ukrainian energy company. However, Ukrainian prosecutors and anti-corruption activists argue that the prosecutor was not actively investigating the company and was actually hindering the investigation. The article highlights that there is no evidence to support the claim that Biden sought to help his son by getting the prosecutor dismissed. So it appears that the article doesn't say what you think it does:

 

[mark francis]

The argument presented contains several claims and assumptions that need to be addressed individually:

"Manafort was brutally arrested by unnecessary force..."

• The characterization of Paul Manafort's arrest as "brutal" and with "unnecessary force" is subjective and not universally accepted. It's important to rely on factual accounts and evidence when discussing the nature of an arrest.

I was wrong. It was Stones scripted arrest by dozens of heavily armed storm troopers in riot gear that was entirely excessive because it was made for leftist news propaganda publication. Nevertheless, Manafort's charges were evidence of Democrat persecution, considering the many others who have done the same thing were never charged even though officials knew they were doing the same thing as Manafort. Manafort's own business partner was not charged for doing the same thing because of his close ties to the Clintons. The democrat dogs made an example of Manafort, just as they made an example of so many others brutally persecuted by Democrats for crooked political reasons.

Recent FARA Cases

www.justice.gov

Manafort was sentenced to 73 months’ imprisonment, including the statutory maximum 60 months for the conspiracy to violate FARA (Manafort is due to serve an additional 17 months stemming from his conviction in the Eastern District of Virginia).

 

[mark francis]

The article discusses the controversy surrounding the firing of Viktor Shokin, Ukraine's prosecutor-general, in March 2016 and its implications in U.S. politics, particularly concerning President Donald Trump and former Vice President Joe Biden.

Key Points:

1. Viktor Shokin's Dismissal: Shokin was fired as Ukraine's prosecutor-general in March 2016, a move seen as a significant step for a country trying to combat corruption. This event later became central to political debates in Washington, affecting Trump's presidency and the 2020 White House race.

If Ukraine was fighting corruption and wanted Burisma brought to justice, then why did they fire the prosecutor who had just seized Burisma assets and why are we claiming Biden's shutting down of the Burisma investigation was a victory for those fighting corruption?

1. Accusations Against Biden: Trump and his allies, including his personal lawyer Rudolph Giuliani, allege that Biden used his position as vice president to protect Burisma, a Ukrainian energy company where his son, Hunter Biden, was a board member, from a criminal investigation. They claim Biden threatened to withhold $1 billion in loan guarantees to Ukraine unless Shokin was fired.

Biden admitted using US aid money as a weapon to force Poroshenko to fire Shokin who had just seized assets belonging to Burisma, effectively shutting down the investigation of Burisma for whom his son worked.

1. Counterarguments: Ukrainian prosecutors and anti-corruption activists dispute this narrative. They argue that the timeline doesn't support Trump's claims and that Shokin was actually hindering the investigation into Burisma. Daria Kaleniuk, from the Anti-Corruption Action Center, stated that Shokin had abandoned significant corruption investigations, including the one into Burisma.

Shokin was not hindering the investigation nearly as much as Joe Biden essentially shuttered the investigation entirely by having Shokin fired just weeks after he seized some of Burisma's assets.

 

[mark francis]

1. Trump-Zelenskiy Phone Call: Reports suggest Trump pressured Ukraine's new president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, during a July 25 phone call to investigate the Bidens. This call became central to a whistle-blower complaint from a U.S. intelligence official.

There was no threat on Trump's call but there were multiple threats on the fake Schiff/Vindmann lying Democrat version of the call.

1. Question of Pressure: Activists and officials in Ukraine argue that the investigation into Burisma's owner, Mykola Zlochevskiy, had been dormant long before Biden's alleged threat. They claim Shokin himself had sabotaged the case. Kaleniuk emphasized that Biden wanted Shokin out because he wasn't pursuing the Burisma case, not because he was actively investigating it.

Shokin was up against corrupt officials from several nations. Courts checked his advance at every turn, much like American courts protect some crooks by dishonest legal maneuverings designed to free the guilty and condemn the innocent. Nevertheless, Shokin was making progress until quid pro Joe Biden showed up and shut everything down.

 

[mark francis]

1. Support for Shokin's Dismissal: Many Western organizations, governments, diplomats, and Ukrainian anti-corruption groups had called for Shokin's firing, including the International Monetary Fund, the European Union, and the U.S. government. They criticized Shokin for damaging Ukraine's legal system.

Why did those groups want the Burisma investigation shut down? Were they also getting rich off the communal Burisma corruption?

 

[mark francis]

1. Burisma's Donation: An annual report revealed that Burisma donated between $100,000 and $250,000 to the Atlantic Council in 2018-19.

Of course. Like Sam Bankman getting suede glove treatment from prosecutors for giving so many tens of millions of dollars to key Democrats from the loot he brutally stole from his deluded investors. Burisma passes out bribes to bent officials and they shut down his legal problems for him, proving Hunter Biden did have a very important role as one of Mykola Zlochevsky's top lieutenants.

 

[Phoenix68]

Let me get this straight. Did Biden go to Ukraine in 2016 to jump start a stalled investigation or did he go there to shut the investigation down completely?

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Ya' know....if you'd do your own research, you wouldn't sound so fuckin' clueless / stupid, here.
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[pjmret]

Why did those groups want the Burisma investigation shut down? Were they also getting rich off the communal Burisma corruption?

Why do you claim this had anything to do specificallly with burisma? present your verified facts that they were related.

or...he was corrupt and people wanted him gone, as they stated. duh

you right wing morons and your conspiracy theories..lol

 

[pjmret]

Of course. Like Sam Bankman getting suede glove treatment from prosecutors for giving so many tens of millions of dollars to key Democrats from the loot he brutally stole from his deluded investors. Burisma passes out bribes to bent officials and they shut down his legal problems for him, proving Hunter Biden did have a very important role as one of Mykola Zlochevsky's top lieutenants.

nah, it proves nothing, unless you have proof? no? lol

 

[mark francis]

Why do you claim this had anything to do specificallly with burisma? present your verified facts that they were related.

or...he was corrupt and people wanted him gone, as they stated. duh

you right wing morons and your conspiracy theories..lol

Let's get the facts straight. Did Biden claim his goal was to get Shokin fired so the investigation into Zlochevsky and Burisma could get moving again? Yes, that is what the habitual liar said, but that is certainly not what he did, using US aid money that was not his to strongarm Poroshenko into doing Biden's will to save his own son.

Trump did not have to ask Zelenskyy to dig up that dirt, it was already old news among US foreign service investigators.

 

[pjmret]

Let's get the facts straight. Did Biden claim his goal was to get Shokin fired so the investigation into Zlochevsky and Burisma could get moving again? Yes, that is what the habitual liar said, but that is certainly not what he did, using US aid money that was not his to strongarm Poroshenko into doing Biden's will to save his own son.

no he didn't claim his goal was that, moron. quote his exact words..oh you can't lol
you are a habitual liar. lol

 

[mark francis]

nah, it proves nothing, unless you have proof? no? lol

Lefties know practically nothing about truth and can prove nothing in their efforts to take down truth and replace it with leftist propagandist lies.