"You Scare Me"

[PLC1]

I see. So according to your dictionary definition, Socialists only want government ownership of the means of production and that's it...

Well, the dictionary is where real definitions of words are found. Of course, you may make up whatever definition you wish.

There is a game that is kind of fun we call the dictionary game. it consists of finding an obscure word that no one knows. Everyone makes up a definition, except for one person, who writes down the real definition. Then, points are awarded for guessing the real definition, as well as when someone chooses the one you made up.

If we played the dictionary game with the word "socialism", which seems to be an obscure word no one knows, some of the made up definitions might be, "soft" Marxist, statist, liberal, or perhaps advocate of the welfare state. The fact is, none of the above are real meanings of the word socialism.

Therefore you would not recognize such things as Progressive taxation, welfare programs, the redistribution of wealth, universal healthcare, and Keynesian economics as having anything to do with Socialism.

Correct. None of those things are socialism. The first ones are hallmarks of statism, which has been around since before Obama was so much as a lustful glance between his parents.

Perhaps you should contact the Democratic Socialists of America and let them know that advocating for the above policies does not qualify them as being Socialists (according to your dictionary definition) and they should either change their name or begin advocating for government ownership of the means of production.

Correct. If they advocate government ownership of the means of production, that is what makes them socialists.

So because all those men were mass murders and Obama is not, you do not believe there can be any legitimate comparison between the policies of Obama and the policies of such despots?

Well, IMO, not being a mass murderer is a pretty big deal. Even a big (bleep!) ing deal, in the words of our vice president.

Between someone who is a mass murderer, and someone who is not, I'll take the one who is not, wouldn't you?

Universal Healthcare
Welfare Programs
Progressive Taxation
Redistribution of Wealth
Keynesian economics

Those are just some of the policy items that Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Obama share.

Yes, and they are all carbon based life forms as well, so I suppose they must be all the same.

Yet by pointing out these facts you think people are actually trying to make the case that Obama is a mass murderer or a Dictator... Hitlers Holocaust policy made him a mass murderer, the policies of the "purges" made the other two mass murderers.

Why else would they use such nefarious examples? Why not compare him to one of the leaders of Western Europe, where all of the things you just mentioned are also a part of their government?

Obama is not advocating for any policies of mass murder and, to my knowledge, nobody here has even suggest that he is. However, simply because he does not advocate for policies of mass murder does not negate the fact that he does advocate for all the previously specified Socialist* policies.

* Socialist according to the DSA and CPUSA rather than the dictionary.

Gee, he doesn't advocate any policies of mass murder. That's a relief. If that's so, why compare him to people who did advocate policies of mass murder?

The logic of comparing the president of the US to the likes of Mao, Stalin, and Hitler is much like saying that Joe Blow likes hot dogs, and so did Charlie Manson, therefore, Joe Blow is just like Charlie Manson, except, of course for that little mass murder thing. Otherwise, they're just the same.

Why the overheated hype and rhetoric? Why not just say that Obama is a left wing liberal, and you don't agree with his policies?

I'm no fan of his big government agenda either, and have said so, but calling him Hitler is just absurd.

 

[Gipper]

Why the overheated hype and rhetoric? Why not just say that Obama is a left wing liberal, and you don't agree with his policies?

I'm no fan of his big government agenda either, and have said so, but calling him Hitler is just absurd.

Well THC I think we have reached common ground, but then again I am never sure with you. So, please correct me if I am wrong.

First, I never called BO Hitler. That is absurd to do so. We agree yes?

When the kooky left compared Bush to Hitler I thought the same way. Did you?

Yes BO is a left wing liberal, but he is much more than that. Bubba BJ Clinton was a left wing liberal, yet no one thinks he would govern like BO.

BO is a Marxist.

Whats it like to have voted for America's first Marxist president? Are you proud of your vote?

 

[PLC1]

Well THC I think we have reached common ground, but then again I am never sure with you. So, please correct me if I am wrong.

First, I never called BO Hitler. That is absurd to do so. We agree yes?

When the kooky left compared Bush to Hitler I thought the same way. Did you?

Yes BO is a left wing liberal, but he is much more than that. Bubba BJ Clinton was a left wing liberal, yet no one thinks he would govern like BO.

BO is a Marxist.

Whats it like to have voted for America's first Marxist president? Are you proud of your vote?

Ok, so we're on the same page up to your last statement.

Maybe you have been learning something from my posts.

Obama is a Marxist? let's take a look at the real definition of that term:

Marx·ism
   /ˈmɑrksɪzəm/ Show Spelled[mahrk-siz-uhm] Show IPA
–noun
the system of economic and political thought developed by Karl Marx, along with Friedrich Engels, esp. the doctrine that the state throughout history has been a device for the exploitation of the masses by a dominant class, that class struggle has been the main agency of historical change, and that the capitalist system, containing from the first the seeds of its own decay, will inevitably, after the period of the dictatorship of the proletariat, be superseded by a socialist order and a classless society.

Is that what you have in mind by using the word "Marxist", or do you have some made up definition in mind? Maybe he's "Marxist light."

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Universal Healthcare
Welfare Programs
Progressive Taxation
Redistribution of Wealth
Keynesian economics
______________

when was the last president to say no progressive taxes?
who was last one that did not redistribute wealth?
When was last one to say no Welfare programs
many have pushed for Univeral health care ( even Nixon)

I guess they are all just like Hitler and Stalin!
Every president since before WWI has been like Hitler and Stalin...and you can see how much worse we are off now then then...

Its funny how this is the "greatest nation on earth" yet all the things we did to get here are wrong...

also how come no one ever brings up nice Capitalist Pinochet? Problem with all those Right wing Latin Leaders Ronny and the rest propped up in the cold war...always killed alot of people or "disappeared them" for being liberal or socialist or Marxist and hundreds of thousands had to flee and are refugee's....but I guess they did not get the kill counts up high enough (not for lack of trying always)


But yep the US is Now like Hitler due to
Universal Healthcare
Welfare Programs
Progressive Taxation
Redistribution of Wealth
Keynesian economics

Now I ask this, what nation on earth does not follow those?
Has no Universal health care ( Hint US is one)
Welfare programs (I don't know of any)
Progressive tax ( first some would debate ours if Progressive, its Regressive many would say)
Name one nation that does not redistribute wealth....


All nations are Hitler! Mao! Stalin!

 

[PLC1]

Universal Healthcare
Welfare Programs
Progressive Taxation
Redistribution of Wealth
Keynesian economics
______________

when was the last president to say no progressive taxes?
who was last one that did not redistribute wealth?
When was last one to say no Welfare programs
many have pushed for Univeral health care ( even Nixon)

I guess they are all just like Hitler and Stalin!
Every president since before WWI has been like Hitler and Stalin...and you can see how much worse we are off now then then...

Its funny how this is the "greatest nation on earth" yet all the things we did to get here are wrong...

also how come no one ever brings up nice Capitalist Pinochet? Problem with all those Right wing Latin Leaders Ronny and the rest propped up in the cold war...always killed alot of people or "disappeared them" for being liberal or socialist or Marxist and hundreds of thousands had to flee and are refugee's....but I guess they did not get the kill counts up high enough (not for lack of trying always)


But yep the US is Now like Hitler due to
Universal Healthcare
Welfare Programs
Progressive Taxation
Redistribution of Wealth
Keynesian economics

Now I ask this, what nation on earth does not follow those?
Has no Universal health care ( Hint US is one)
Welfare programs (I don't know of any)
Progressive tax ( first some would debate ours if Progressive, its Regressive many would say)
Name one nation that does not redistribute wealth....


All nations are Hitler! Mao! Stalin!

Only if you ignore the minor detail about being or not being mass murderers and despots.

Other than that, every leader of the western world is like Hitler, Mao, and Stalin.

As we've already see, being a mass murderer and despot is just a minor matter compared to supporting the programs you mention.

 

[Little-Acorn]

Well, the dictionary is where real definitions of words are found.

I have had people quote various dictionaries to me, which said that "liberal" means "supporting liberty", and "conservative" means "wanting to keep government the same as it presently is".

I believe that disposes of the "the dictionary is where real definitions of words are found" fallacy......

 

[GenSeneca]

Well, the dictionary is where real definitions of words are found.

Democrat: An advocate of democracy.
Republican: One who favors a Republic.

Complex concepts and philosophies are often oversimplified in dictionary definitions to the point where they lose much of their true meaning.

From the DSA "What is Democratic Socialism"?:

In the short term we can’t eliminate private corporations, but we can bring them under greater democratic control. The government could use regulations and tax incentives to encourage companies to act in the public interest and outlaw destructive activities such as exporting jobs to low-wage countries and polluting our environment. Public pressure can also have a critical role to play in the struggle to hold corporations accountable. Most of all, socialists look to unions make private business more accountable.

...

Q: Aren't you in competition with the Democrat Party?

No, we are not a separate party. Like our friends and allies in the feminist, labor, civil rights, religious,
and community organizing movements, many of us have been active in the Democratic Party. We work with
those movements to strengthen the party’s left wing, represented by the Congressional Progressive Caucus.

...

Although capitalism will be with us for a long time, reforms we win now—raising the minimum wage, securing a national health plan, and demanding passage of right-to-strike legislation—can bring us closer to socialism.

Many democratic socialists actively work in the single-issue organizations that advocate for those reforms. We are visible in the reproductive freedom movement, the fight for student aid, gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered organizations, anti-racist groups, and the labor movement.

It is precisely our socialist vision that informs and inspires our day-to-day activism for social justice.

Of course... We should never refer to these policies as Socialist since they don't fit the dictionary definition you are using...

Perhaps we should look at the other dictionary definitions for Socialism just to be sure..

Socialism: 3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.

"We are just 5 days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America." - Obama

I'm no fan of his big government agenda either, and have said so, but calling him Hitler is just absurd.

Yes, calling Obama Hitler is absurd but the only person to do so in this thread was you:

"Obama is Hitler"

 

[GenSeneca]

also how come no one ever brings up nice Capitalist Pinochet?

Pinochet a Capitalist? LOL... You're so adorable.

All nations are Hitler! Mao! Stalin!

All nations have become Socialist to one degree or another.

I think it's sad we are following suit.

 

[PLC1]

I have had people quote various dictionaries to me, which said that "liberal" means "supporting liberty", and "conservative" means "wanting to keep government the same as it presently is".

I believe that disposes of the "the dictionary is where real definitions of words are found" fallacy......

OK, so make up your own definitions, then.

A horse is a little animal with short ears and whiskers that purrs and likes to curl up on your couch.

That is, if I can make up any definition I want to, why not?

 

[PLC1]

Yes, calling Obama Hitler is absurd but the only person to do so in this thread was you:

Who is the guy with the silly little mustache?

Posted by Pandora:

It's fair enough to say early obama is not like late hitler, but I also think its fair to say that early hitler (pre killing people) was much like early obama.

So, maybe he only looks like Hitler, and is not a "late" Hitler, but an "early" one.

I'm glad we agree that calling Obama Hitler is absurd.

You do agree with the dictionary definition of "absurd", don't you? It doesn't really mean "proven fact accepted by all thinking people" in some parallel universe, does it?

 

[GenSeneca]

Who is the guy with the silly little mustache?

George W. Bush?

 

[GenSeneca]

Who is the guy with the silly little mustache?

As a more serious response... Steve did not say "Obama is Hitler", neither did Pandora. The only people to use that expression are you and Pocket. If the poster is meant to be interpreted as saying "Obama is Hitler", why put Lenin on the poster at all? Why not just use a photoshopped picture of Obama made to look like Hitler with the words, "Obama is Hitler!" right there on the poster? ...The Left did that with Bush for 8 years.

So, maybe he only looks like Hitler, and is not a "late" Hitler, but an "early" one.

Pandora did not say the two men physically "looked alike" and she did not say "Obama is Hitler", she was referring to the similarities between the two men which are entirely valid, conditions and policy. I'll be glad to outline some of these similiarities if you do not think any valid ones exist. As Pocket pointed out, there are similiarities that can be drawn about Hitler and nearly all modern politicians.

I'm glad we agree that calling Obama Hitler is absurd.

Good, now maybe you and Pocket will stop saying it.

 

[Gipper]

Good, now maybe you and Pocket will stop saying it.

I kinda doubt it.

They get this crap from their lib media outlets every day. They must regurgitate it here.

Oh well. It was a nice effort and clearly shows their bias.

Question: How come the cons here have not mentioned the kook at the Discovery Channel and what motivated him???

 

[Pandora]

Who is the guy with the silly little mustache?

Posted by Pandora:



So, maybe he only looks like Hitler, and is not a "late" Hitler, but an "early" one.

I'm glad we agree that calling Obama Hitler is absurd.

You do agree with the dictionary definition of "absurd", don't you? It doesn't really mean "proven fact accepted by all thinking people" in some parallel universe, does it?

I did not post that

 

[Pandora]

Question: How come the cons here have not mentioned the kook at the Discovery Channel and what motivated him???[/QUOT

People have tried to talk about various things in the past to show the libs what they look like when they CONSTANTLY do it to conservatives, They never admit it and its become a waste of time.

We know what they would do if the tables were turned and really that is all that matters