1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Discuss politics - join our community by registering for free here! HOP - the political discussion forum

An Obama Issue

Discussion in 'U.S. Politics' started by Dr.Who, Jun 15, 2008.

  1. Dr.Who

    Dr.Who Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Messages:
    6,776
    Likes Received:
    251
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Horse Country

    You have earned my respect and so your wish is my command.

    Googling "obama platform" I found this site:
    http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

    The first issue presented is this:

    "Civil Rights:
    There is no more fundamental American right than the right to vote. Before the landmark 1965 Voting Rights Act, barriers such as literacy tests, poll taxes and property requirements disenfranchised many Americans, especially minorities. More than 40 years later, there are still numerous obstacles to ensuring that every citizen has the ability to vote."

    I clicked on the link titled "continue reading" and I get this:

    “The teenagers and college students who left their homes to march in the streets of Birmingham and Montgomery; the mothers who walked instead of taking the bus after a long day of doing somebody else's laundry and cleaning somebody else's kitchen — they didn't brave fire hoses and Billy clubs so that their grandchildren and their great-grandchildren would still wonder at the beginning of the 21st century whether their vote would be counted; whether their civil rights would be protected by their government; whether justice would be equal and opportunity would be theirs. . . . We have more work to do.”

    — Barack Obama, Speech at Howard University, September 28, 2007

    It then says that Senator Obamas plan is:

    "End Deceptive Voting Practices
    Obama will sign into law his legislation that establishes harsh penalties for those who have engaged in voter fraud and provides voters who have been misinformed with accurate and full information so they can vote."

    The first problem I see is that he has presented no evidence that any obstacles still exist.

    So I googled that and this (following a list of long gone historical obstacles like poll taxes) is what I got: (I added the boldface)
    http://www.cliffsnotes.com/WileyCDA...ing.topicArticleId-25170,articleId-25127.html

    "Other restrictions to voting
    Although all the limitations on African Americans' voting have been abolished, they were not the only group affected by restrictions. Native Americans became eligible to vote in 1924 when they were made citizens of the United States by an act of Congress. It was not until 1952 that Congress overturned 19th-century laws that had denied citizenship to Asian immigrants.

    Even today, voter registration requirements make it difficult, if not impossible, for some people to vote. In order to register, an applicant must have a permanent address, which the homeless do not have. Thousands of college students who go away to school can vote only “back home” through an absentee ballot. Many Americans find voting a chore because they move homes rapidly, and renewing their voter registration in the new locale is not a high priority."
    (his plan quoted above doesn't even address these minor problems)

    I have also heard that the need for a photo ID is a barrier.
    This site, linked below says this:
    http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2005/04/states-heighten-obstacles-to-voting.asp

    "20 states now require some form of identification, but Georgia and South Carolina will be the most restrictive, forcing voters to fill out a provisional ballot if they have no picture ID -- a form of voting more easily challenged and disqualified. Florida, Hawaii, Louisiana and South Dakota also require photo ID, but allow voters to sign an affidavit verifying their voter information as an alternative."

    Clearly there are many many more examples of dead people voting and people arriving at the polls to discover that they have already voted than there are people who don't have a photo ID AND could not fill out a form if they did not have one.

    So if this adds up correctly Senetor Obama's most important civil rights issue is a virtually non-existent problem of obstacles to voting.

    In general when I read his speeches or hear about what he wants to do to make changes in our country I find that he is talking about non-issues. I see him primarily wanting to make real changes to make a more powerful federal government in response to unreal problems.
     
  2. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2008
    Messages:
    11,790
    Likes Received:
    257
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    The people's republic of Eugene
    If Obama was truly concerned about the voter, he would have done everything in his power to be sure that Michigan and Florida were counted fully, way back when they mattered. I hear now that they don’t matter he is fighting to get them to count fully.

    If someone says I can not vote because I do not have photo ID, I would ask them how you got registered to vote in the first place without photo ID (unless you live in Oregon, where voter fraud is abundant and no one needs to show any ID of any kind to register to vote by mail.)
     
  3. Libsmasher

    Libsmasher New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,151
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Excellent. All chatter about "civil rights" nowadays is tiresome gum flapping, since liberals have practically erased the bill of rights.
     
  4. BigRob

    BigRob Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2007
    Messages:
    7,366
    Likes Received:
    314
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    USA
    Obama's tax plan is pathetic as well.

    He will raise capital gains taxes. That will effect millions of middle class Americans as their pensions are tied up in the stock market. Further, historically speaking, the higher the Capital Gains rate, the lower the revenue that comes in from it.

    Further, Obama's plan to tax windfall profits on oil companies is a disaster as well. It is the same as saying "Yes Exxon, you take all of the risk by drilling, and should you hit and make a good profit, we will take it."

    And this idea that our world image and influence will improve by leaving Iraq is a joke. We will never maintain a good image with extremists in the Middle East, but there are many moderate Arab nations who would view a pull out of Iraq as the United States abandoning them and our promises. This would lead to a lack of influence in the most important part of the world when we need it most.
     
  5. pocketfullofshells

    pocketfullofshells Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2008
    Messages:
    12,009
    Likes Received:
    203
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    land of 10,000 lakes and 2 senators again
    How many times do we have to say this, its the Damn partys rules, the state parties did not follow the rules, the election was handled based on DNC Rules, and everyone agreed to them. But you wanted Clinton so you cry like Obama cheated by following the same damn rules.
     
  6. GenSeneca

    GenSeneca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    6,245
    Likes Received:
    501
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    ={CaLiCo}= HQ
    I'm flattered and Honored, thank you Dr. Who :)

    Dr. Who, I give to you the Holy Grail of quotes for this issue, made by Barack Obama himself on the floor of our Senate:

    "...there's been no showing that there's any significant problem with voter fraud in the 50 states." --Sen. Barack Obama

    Its on public record ON HIS senatorial website, for those who feel I have taken him out of context - or otherwise misrepresented his statement, Please feel free to read his entire address to the President of the Senate - HERE -

    Now pick your jaw up off the floor while I move onto the second part of the quote from: "End Deceptive Voting Practices"

    Raise your hand if you know what "misinformed" is a reference to.... Anybody... Anybody at all? Turns out, Obama thinks = America = should print all its government related information - especially voting ballots - in Spanish as well as English.

    For those who don't know, LEGAL immigrants have to learn BASIC English and many of them know the basics before they even arrive on our soil. Who would need a ballot in Spanish??

    "...shouldn't we make sure non-citizens aren't casting ballots to change the outcome of elections?" --Obama

    Its important to note Obama has always been, just as all the Democrats, against legislation that requires voters to show ID to vote:

    "There certainly is no showing that non-citizens are rushing to try to vote: this is a solution in search of a problem."--Obama

    With an UNKNOWN number of ILLEGAL immigrants living inside the United States, guesstimated between 12 and 20 million, Obama's against them proving citizenship to vote - and to make things easy for them - will print our Election ballots in Spanish. Viva la Mexico Mr. Obama.
     
  7. Libsmasher

    Libsmasher New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,151
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Penalizing the democrat rank and file in those states for what the state party leaders did remains stupid. The DNC's "solution" probably added insult to injury, and republicans now probably have a good chance to take both states. A tip o' the GOP hat to Screamin' Howie Deane. :D
     
  8. BigRob

    BigRob Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2007
    Messages:
    7,366
    Likes Received:
    314
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    USA
    Obama also includes these estimated illegals when he speaks about people in American with no healthcare by the way.
     
  9. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2008
    Messages:
    11,790
    Likes Received:
    257
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    The people's republic of Eugene
    Did you read my post?

    My point was NOT that the two states went early and were being punished.


    My point WAS that while it was not politically to Obama’s advantage he fought good and hard to keep them from being seated at all, and when he finally caved it was for half of Florida and Michigan’s delegates to be seated. Then he took everyone’s votes but Hillary’s in Michigan and then stole 4 of hers. All the time, insisting these are the rules and we must go by them.


    BUT now that he has the delegates needed he is assuring both states that he will have them seated in full, because now it is to Obama’s political advantage to not piss off both states whose voters are suggesting either keeping Obama off of the ballot or giving him half a vote.


    Why was it so important to follow the dirty DNC rules before but now that it can not hurt him he wants to break the DNC rules?

    Any way, it does not matter. I am glad the votes will count in full.

    This thread is good, and this post is getting it off topic.
     
  10. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2008
    Messages:
    11,790
    Likes Received:
    257
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    The people's republic of Eugene
    Some times when Obama is asked how he will pay for his plans he says we can use the money currently being spent in Iraq.

    But other times he says we can not afford to borrow this money from China to fund the war because our children and their children will have to pay for it.

    I can not tell for sure if he is saying we should stop borrowing the money or if the borrowing is ok as long as it goes to another program.

    He has given mixed answers from what I have seen. Does anyone know for sure how he plans to pay for his 1 trillion dollars in new spending budget?
     
  11. BigRob

    BigRob Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2007
    Messages:
    7,366
    Likes Received:
    314
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    USA
    Higher taxes.
     
  12. Pandora

    Pandora Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2008
    Messages:
    11,790
    Likes Received:
    257
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    The people's republic of Eugene
    Well that is a given, but I mean 1 trillion dollars in new spending, he will need to do more than raise taxes.

    He has said he will use the Iraq war money we borrow from China in some interviews, and said we will stop borrowing money from China because its causing our kids to have a bill they can never pay off in other interviews.

    Has he decided yet what one will be his policy? Does any one know ?
     
  13. GenSeneca

    GenSeneca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    6,245
    Likes Received:
    501
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    ={CaLiCo}= HQ
    I wonder if Obama will be soft on "Big Tobacco"...

    [​IMG]

    Ok, cheapshot but thats a great pic!
    ------------------------------------------------

    I'd be glad to take on any more of Obama's issues, just pick one and I'll be glad to take it from there! :)
     
  14. Dr.Who

    Dr.Who Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2007
    Messages:
    6,776
    Likes Received:
    251
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Horse Country

    That's ripe. I mean that is the best quote yet. Even Sen Obama doesn't think what is says is serious is serious. Has he addressed a significant issue yet in all of his talking?
     
  15. pocketfullofshells

    pocketfullofshells Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2008
    Messages:
    12,009
    Likes Received:
    203
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    land of 10,000 lakes and 2 senators again

    The State Parties Broke the Rules, the Party Followed the Rules. Get over it. There is a reason there are those rules in place, and evryone knew the Rules. FLorida and Michigan did not follow the rules, so where punished, as stated in the rules. For Michigan to haev been fair, you would have all there votes count? realy becuse there was not Election there, there was a vote For CLinton or nothing. Obama was not even on the Ballot. If the party let all off there votes count you know what happens next time? All the other states move up even more, and you can't punish them.....so the next time they move up even more Becuause they all want to be first.

    They are Rules for the party, not suggested guidlines.
    DO those simple facts not sink in for you? That he followed the rules set up by all sides, and agreed to. If you are mad, to talk to the State parties who violated the rules, quit crying for CLinton. YOu know non of the others who ran seem to have any problem with it, nor did she, till she wanted the votes so she could win.

    And you would call that fair, to change the rules after the fact so your person wins.And that somehow the voters got a Fair Vote....not having evryone even on the Ballot.
     
Loading...

Share This Page