Since 9/11 Americans have killed around 300,000 Americans

[GenSeneca]

You are far more likey to be killed by a American then a Terrorist from al-Qaeda.

What's your point? The US should invade America and kill Americans because Americans pose the greatest threat to Americans?

You guys are comparing acts of war done by terrorists who have declared war on our country to criminal acts done by American citizens who are NOT at war with the country... You must believe you have some really profound point to make if you're offering such an irrational comparison. So lets hear it.

 

[BigRob]

I might suggest you all siding with Dawkins go back and reread his original post in this thread.

His question was:
"So which group is worse...Americans or AQ?"

His assertion was:
"So, let's assume for the sake of argument that AQ did perpetrate the attack on the twin towers, this means that Americans have killed around a hundred times as many Americans as AQ have done on US soil between September 8th 2001 and today."

His argument is a statistical comparison between which group is more violent -- and statistically -- over the last decade -- AQ has been the more violent group -- as has been shown with a simple comparison.

You want to move the goal posts and make the issue about something new, then by all means, go for it -- but just remember that it is not what the original question was. You change the parameters of the arguments to be something that was not originally claimed (and I would probably agree with the moved goalposts) -- but the simple fact remains:

When you compare the breakdown of which group is more violent over the last decade (as was the original question) -- it remains that AQ has been the more violent group.

 

[dogtowner]

I might suggest you all siding with Dawkins go back and reread his original post in this thread.

His question was:
"So which group is worse...Americans or AQ?"

His assertion was:
"So, let's assume for the sake of argument that AQ did perpetrate the attack on the twin towers, this means that Americans have killed around a hundred times as many Americans as AQ have done on US soil between September 8th 2001 and today."

His argument is a statistical comparison between which group is more violent -- and statistically -- over the last decade -- AQ has been the more violent group -- as has been shown with a simple comparison.

You want to move the goal posts and make the issue about something new, then by all means, go for it -- but just remember that it is not what the original question was. You change the parameters of the arguments to be something that was not originally claimed (and I would probably agree with the moved goalposts) -- but the simple fact remains:

When you compare the breakdown of which group is more violent over the last decade (as was the original question) -- it remains that AQ has been the more violent group.

Quite a lot of goalpost moving. Perhaps now that football season is over they can be left in place.
I don't think I'll be holding my breath on that though.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

What's your point? The US should invade America and kill Americans because Americans pose the greatest threat to Americans?

You guys are comparing acts of war done by terrorists who have declared war on our country to criminal acts done by American citizens who are NOT at war with the country... You must believe you have some really profound point to make if you're offering such an irrational comparison. So lets hear it.

its amazing how you make things what ever your mind wants to them to be with no regard to facts. I pointed out that Robs statement that you where more likey to be killed by a terrorist was not correct...had you read my first post you would know that I think the Original post by Darwin is completely off base and and that any Debate with someone posting such ideas would be pointless. Truthers are like Birthers...you can't use logic and facts...

so here is my profound statement...you have no idea what your talking about...

 

[pocketfullofshells]

I might suggest you all siding with Dawkins go back and reread his original post in this thread.

His question was:
"So which group is worse...Americans or AQ?"

His assertion was:
"So, let's assume for the sake of argument that AQ did perpetrate the attack on the twin towers, this means that Americans have killed around a hundred times as many Americans as AQ have done on US soil between September 8th 2001 and today."

His argument is a statistical comparison between which group is more violent -- and statistically -- over the last decade -- AQ has been the more violent group -- as has been shown with a simple comparison.

You want to move the goal posts and make the issue about something new, then by all means, go for it -- but just remember that it is not what the original question was. You change the parameters of the arguments to be something that was not originally claimed (and I would probably agree with the moved goalposts) -- but the simple fact remains:

When you compare the breakdown of which group is more violent over the last decade (as was the original question) -- it remains that AQ has been the more violent group.

Its statistically stupid...its a pointless argument, and anyone who would try to make it does not have a clue...

of course all I said was that you are in fact more likely to be killed by a American then a Terrorist. And you know that is true...But yet you said the reverse.

 

[Dawkinsrocks]

Big rob, my point is not about which group has been more violent

It is about which is worse? A group that has killed hundreds of thousands of Americans or a group that has killed 3000

Your desperate sophistry just shows how brainwashed Americans are.

If the US spent the money it is spending on killing muslims on tackling domestic crime the average American would be much safer. But a small number of oil barons would be poorer

You are persuaded to vote against your own interests by the lies your government tells you and this thread shows how effective they are at suckering you

A trillion dollars spent on wars against countries that are no threat to the US

Imagine what that money could have done at home

It could have provided free healthcare for all

Shit, sorry, I forgot

You lot prefer murdering Muslims to healing sick Americans

What a fucked up nauseating cuntry

 

[GenSeneca]

I pointed out that Robs statement that you where more likey to be killed by a terrorist was not correct....

Rob never claimed that you were more likely to be killed by a terrorist than an American... Of course "you make things what ever your mind wants them to be without regard to facts."

 

[Dawkinsrocks]

Oh so Rob is saying you are much more likely to be killed by an American than AQ but AQ is worse?

Bizarre

 

[Alias]

Oh so Rob is saying you are much more likely to be killed by an American than AQ but AQ is worse?

Bizarre

Oh yes, the USA is a much bigger threat to world peace. If it wasn't for the mean nasty USA, the world would be a Utopia. Yup.

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Statistically -- I am far less likely to be murdered by my fellow US citizens over the last decade.

I am sorry Gen..you where saying what?

 

[pocketfullofshells]

My statement is a mathematical fact.

Over the last decade, I was less likely to be murdered by an American than to be killed by an AQ terrorist.

again...your basic idea that his argument has no merit is correct...but the odds of you being killed by AQ Terrorist are very very small...the odds of being killed by your Wife are higher.

Your basically saying that taking one person over the last 10 years that was murdered...that the there is a higher percent chance that that person was killed on Sept 11..then every other day combined basically...and that is not true...

Again as for the rest of what your saying, your correct...The number you are useing is showing that AQ is a far more Efficient killer of Americans...per person committing a murder.

 

[Dawkinsrocks]

Great post

Those hundreds of thousands of Americans killed by Americans are less dead aren't they?

The efficiency of the killers is not important

The question is really, which group represents the biggest threat to Americans on US soil

The answer is unequivocally Americans but you don't like the conclusion because of its implications in favour of targeting money at addressing domestic crime rather than killing Muslims abroad

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Great post

Those hundreds of thousands of Americans killed by Americans are less dead aren't they?

The efficiency of the killers is not important

The question is really, which group represents the biggest threat to Americans on US soil

The answer is unequivocally Americans but you don't like the conclusion because of its implications in favour of targeting money at addressing domestic crime rather than killing Muslims abroad

first all you would not think it so great if you realized that I pretty much said you are wrong. I spend my whole day surrounded by Americans...so I am more likely to have anything happen to me good or bad...be from one. Even if you lived in Iraq...during the war...if you where a Civilian you where more likely to be killed by al-Quida then a American even though we where at war. In Pakistan your more likely to be killed by a Suicide bomber in a market..then killed accidentally by a Drone Attack. The only thing that makes Americans more safe from terrorist is ...that they are not here in large numbers. replace evry American that murdered anyone last year..with a al-Quida linked Terrorist...and the US would be a blood bath of Death. Also Murders , don't effect natinal security in any way on the scale that Terrorism does. Also your trying to imply that somehow Sept 11 was a inside job or some bull just makes you sound like a crackpot with nothing of value to add to a real debate.

 

[dogtowner]

first all you would not think it so great if you realized that I pretty much said you are wrong.

I chuckled when I read his response to you as well.

 

[Dawkinsrocks]

If you lived in Iraq you are thousands of times more likely to be killed by an American than by AQ

Americans have killed a million Iraqis in the most recent war alone

In fact you are more likely to be killed by an American than any other nationality in the world anywhere