Voters in my state are stupid

[dogtowner]

We continue to disagree on the Unions. If it wasn't for the Unions, the workers of Americas (all of them, NOT just those who are members of an Union) would still be working 10 hours a day for close to minimum wage, with no benefits.

We do seem to agree on the negative impact of the "blank check" allowed by the Right Wing Supreme Court on REAL representation of the people in the government.

unions DID help workers 80 years ago or so. since then regulation was put in place that makes them obsolete ergo their demise (public sector unions are the only one4s growing all others are shrinking).

that SCOTUS decision was 100% correct. the one making money = free speech is at best a stretch and a terrible idea that needs to be corrected.

 

[Openmind]

I'm sorry to be so dense. . . but

You think that without any Unions, the big corps wouldn't have free range to do exactly what they want with workers? Especially in high unemployment eras? You're dreaming!

And. . .you are confusing me: You think that the Supreme court decision was totally correct to give permission to ANY big corps (including multi-nationas, global corporations) to give as much money as they want to influence (to BUY) who will be our next President, what will be our next Congress?

And you think that free speech is served by this decision? What needs to be corrected?

Please clarify.

 

[dogtowner]

I'm sorry to be so dense. . . but

You think that without any Unions, the big corps wouldn't have free range to do exactly what they want with workers? Especially in high unemployment eras? You're dreaming!

today workers have remedy of federal law to settle disputes and have for quite some time.
The unions served their purpose now they are just taking dues to fund DEM politics.

And. . .you are confusing me: You think that the Supreme court decision was totally correct to give permission to ANY big corps (including multi-nationas, global corporations) to give as much money as they want to influence (to BUY) who will be our next President, what will be our next Congress?

And you think that free speech is served by this decision? What needs to be corrected?

Please clarify.

before this decision only select non-human beings could give whatever they wanted. now that unequal application has been made equal. equal protection under the law.

free speech is not served by saying that giving money (by anyone or anything) is somehow free speech. its either charity or a business transaction. and politicians are not charities.

 

[Openmind]

today workers have remedy of federal law to settle disputes and have for quite some time.
The unions served their purpose now they are just taking dues to fund DEM politics.



before this decision only select non-human beings could give whatever they wanted. now that unequal application has been made equal. equal protection under the law.

free speech is not served by saying that giving money (by anyone or anything) is somehow free speech. its either charity or a business transaction. and politicians are not charities.

Obviously I disagree. But then again. ..what's new!
You are 100% for big corporations and elite run politics.
I still believe in the intent of the Constitution that "Government should be of the people by the people," and just making "fake" people by calling multi-national and global corporations "people" is not enough to convince me that, a defense contractor providing arms to anyone who wants to buy them, or big multi-national oil corporation deciding that they need the oil that currently belongs to Iran, answers the intent of our founders.

 

[dogtowner]

Obviously I disagree. But then again. ..what's new!
You are 100% for big corporations and elite run politics.
I still believe in the intent of the Constitution that "Government should be of the people by the people," and just making "fake" people by calling multi-national and global corporations "people" is not enough to convince me that, a defense contractor providing arms to anyone who wants to buy them, or big multi-national oil corporation deciding that they need the oil that currently belongs to Iran, answers the intent of our founders.

or a union which is no more a "people" than IBM. just m ake it equal

 

[Openmind]

or a union which is no more a "people" than IBM. just m ake it equal

I disagree. Unions represent the WORKERS. IBM represents the CORPORATE interests, not THEIR WORKERS. In fact, IBM will try to use their lobbying AGAINST their workers. . .to increase the power of the corporation, while decreasing the power of the work force.

In fact, big corporations like IBM, APPLE, and HP will lobby the government to keep their tax breaks for jobs they send oversea. . .while the Union will lobby the government to provide more incentives to KEEP the jobs in America.

Big corporations will support a candidate whom they think will provide big capital gain tax breaks that are totally skewed toward their biggest stock holders and their board of director. . .while the Union will support a candidate that will defend the rights of all workers to earn a decent wage that will shrink the huge gap between the "average worker" in a corporation and the CEO.

Big corporation are lobbying for a few elite in the corporation. Unions are lobbying for the majority of workers in a corporation. PACS are the voice of the top 1% of the corporation, while Unions are the voice of the 99% of the corporation.

BIG difference!

 

[dogtowner]

I disagree. Unions represent the WORKERS. IBM represents the CORPORATE interests, not THEIR WORKERS. In fact, IBM will try to use their lobbying AGAINST their workers. . .to increase the power of the corporation, while decreasing the power of the work force.

In fact, big corporations like IBM, APPLE, and HP will lobby the government to keep their tax breaks for jobs they send oversea. . .while the Union will lobby the government to provide more incentives to KEEP the jobs in America.

Big corporations will support a candidate whom they think will provide big capital gain tax breaks that are totally skewed toward their biggest stock holders and their board of director. . .while the Union will support a candidate that will defend the rights of all workers to earn a decent wage that will shrink the huge gap between the "average worker" in a corporation and the CEO.

Big corporation are lobbying for a few elite in the corporation. Unions are lobbying for the majority of workers in a corporation. PACS are the voice of the top 1% of the corporation, while Unions are the voice of the 99% of the corporation.

BIG difference!

labor now has law on their side and for all the bought and paid for union political influence they are failing the workers badly.

 

[Openmind]

labor now has law on their side and for all the bought and paid for union political influence they are failing the workers badly.

They sure haven't failed me!

And, apparently, they haven't failed that many workers. . .ask the Wisconsin governor what he thinks of the Union's support for their workers!

 

[dogtowner]

They sure haven't failed me!

And, apparently, they haven't failed that many workers. . .ask the Wisconsin governor what he thinks of the Union's support for their workers!

they lost, poor example

 

[Openmind]

they lost, poor example

I think it's a great exemple. . .The Union workers (the Unions) lost agains the few big business elites (the Koch brothers, with their puppet Walker).

And now. . .the puppet has a very good chance to be recalled!

This actually perfectly illustrated my point: Citizen United decision was a horrible, unfair, and "paid for by big business" decision.

 

[dogtowner]

I think it's a great exemple. . .The Union workers (the Unions) lost agains the few big business elites (the Koch brothers, with their puppet Walker).

And now. . .the puppet has a very good chance to be recalled!

This actually perfectly illustrated my point: Citizen United decision was a horrible, unfair, and "paid for by big business" decision.

you have set the bar quite low for success.

 

[Openmind]

you have set the bar quite low for success.

In this case, getting rid of the Koch brothers' puppet is quite a success, thank you!

 

[dogtowner]

In this case, getting rid of the Koch brothers' puppet is quite a success, thank you!

methinks its a little early to be counting those chickens.

 

[Openmind]

methinks its a little early to be counting those chickens.

You're right. . .Walker isn't out yet. It is obvious that the Koch brothers will do their best to inundate the state with their money to keep their puppet in. . .Another good illustration of my earlier statement re: the evils of "Citizens United."

However, it's kind of nice that twice as many signatures as needed to begin the recall have already been obtained.

Obviously, it is clear that the Koch Brothers will not stop at anything . . .and that if money doesn't work to sway the votes, there is always fraud!

 

[dogtowner]

You're right. . .Walker isn't out yet. It is obvious that the Koch brothers will do their best to inundate the state with their money to keep their puppet in. . .Another good illustration of my earlier statement re: the evils of "Citizens United."

However, it's kind of nice that twice as many signatures as needed to begin the recall have already been obtained.

Obviously, it is clear that the Koch Brothers will not stop at anything . . .and that if money doesn't work to sway the votes, there is always fraud!

has it occurred to you that:
the people of Wisc elected Walker to institute fiscal responsibility ?
the unions have spent lavishly there before and after CU ?
there is a difference between what people do in public than what they do in private ? (sign petition as opposed to vote, union votes fail frequently due to this ergo "Card Check")