Finally, a sign that Obama thinks the economic crash is serious!

[Lagboltz]

If someone has the money or means and wants it they should be able to get it.

That's fine.

Most importantly though is this...

We cannot decide for ourselves the value of another persons life.

If we are going to reduce Medicare and Medicaid, these decisions are going to have to be made. I'm a liberal and I don't know what I would do without Medicare. Conservatives do want to eliminate it or cut it down. That means somebody is going to have to make decisions on what to do with very expensive procedures.

 

[Lagboltz]

I am not familiar with that drug, so I wouldn't know.

I assume, from your description, that it is administered only at stage 4 prostate cancer then?

Yes

Well, I'm sorry, I think there is a time when we have to remember that LIFE is a terminal disease. At some point, we need to let go.

And, please realize that I am 61, so I am starting to realize my own mortality, although I am extremely healthy, and I am a cancer survivor (15 years).

I really hope that, when the time comes for me to check out, I will know it, and I will do so gracefully, without "heroic" measures that are so hard on both the patient and their family.

I think the prostate drug is an example of the gray area of expense where Medicare has made a decision. I think the decision to pay $93,000 to prolong an incurable disease for only 4 months is a high price. But it is that or the creation of Palin's "Death Panels" to bring down the costs of Medicare.

 

[Pandora]

you are in fact deciding the value of someones life...the system you support says that the rich can be cured and the poor don't have to be...you are in fact deciding that those who can afford it, have lives that are worth more.

Just the opposite really I am advocating for an individuals right. You seem to be the one saying if the middle class cant have well then neither can the rich.

A few years of obamacare and there will be no private insurance. Everything will be run by the government and just like canada and england no one will be able to get certain care unless they leave the country, England and canada can come here, we wont have anywhere to go.

 

[Pandora]

I totally agree with that!

However, I disagree with your decision to do nothing if you get breast cancer. Once again, breast cancer is highly curable (I know, I had it). In fact, I have a friend who, four years ago, was diagnosed with stage 4 breast cancer. She was told she had 6 months to live, and the doctor told her that, it was up to her, but he didn't think a mastectomy at that stage would prolong her life (it was already in her bones and her brain).

But, today she is still living with cancer. She saw her only daughter get married, and she now has a grand daughter. She is ill, but still feels well enough to get out a couple of times a week, to travel to see her grand daughter in Florida, and to play bridge twice a month.

I hope, if ever you are are faced with breast cancer, you will consider all your options.

Those were very nice words, I thank you. I saw my aunts get cut apart piece by piece and it did prolong their life but I don't want to live that way. I have see chemotherapy and how it makes you feel. Cut off my breasts?? ugh I hate this topic

Did you highlight the last line of my previous post?

 

[pocketfullofshells]

Just the opposite really I am advocating for an individuals right. You seem to be the one saying if the middle class cant have well then neither can the rich.

A few years of obamacare and there will be no private insurance. Everything will be run by the government and just like canada and england no one will be able to get certain care unless they leave the country, England and canada can come here, we wont have anywhere to go.

if anything the health care bill stenghens the insurance companies with even more people in the system.

and your idea of individual rights...only applies to those who can afford it...and to those who don't have a pre existing condition..and to those who don't get so sick insurance drops them...and to ....

Rights for those who can afford them...none for those who can't.

 

[GenSeneca]

Rights for those who can afford them...none for those who can't.

Health Care is a service, not a Right.

 

[Pandora]

if anything the health care bill stenghens the insurance companies with even more people in the system.

and your idea of individual rights...only applies to those who can afford it...and to those who don't have a pre existing condition..and to those who don't get so sick insurance drops them...and to ....

Rights for those who can afford them...none for those who can't.

NO, I want rights even for those who cannot speak yet and are unwanted by the people who are deciding their fate.

There will always be poor and rich, it's a personal choice.

My grandmother and her brother and sister inherited literally millions of dollars each. The brother squandered his on his kids and various women and died penny less. Her sister squandered hers going to Europe and eating the finest of food and wearing the finest clothing, she died in a nursing home at government expense. My grandmother invested hers and still lives on it even though she was and still is the most generous woman I have ever known to me and to strangers alike.

Take someone poor and give them a million, chances are they will be poor again in 5 years ... probably less.

Take someone who made a million dollars and take it away, they will probably be a high roller again in 5 years.

Unless we want a nation where we decide for everyone how they live their lives, there will always be people who spend their money on stupid things instead of saving for healthcare issues.

 

[GenSeneca]

Take someone who made a million dollars and take it away, they will probably be a high roller again in 5 years.

By Pocket's "logic", that's all the more reason to take it away from them.

 

[Lagboltz]

NO, I want rights even for those who cannot speak yet and are unwanted by the people who are deciding their fate.

There will always be poor and rich, it's a personal choice.

My grandmother and her brother and sister inherited literally millions of dollars each. The brother squandered his on his kids and various women and died penny less. Her sister squandered hers going to Europe and eating the finest of food and wearing the finest clothing, she died in a nursing home at government expense. My grandmother invested hers and still lives on it even though she was and still is the most generous woman I have ever known to me and to strangers alike.

Take someone poor and give them a million, chances are they will be poor again in 5 years ... probably less.

Take someone who made a million dollars and take it away, they will probably be a high roller again in 5 years.

Unless we want a nation where we decide for everyone how they live their lives, there will always be people who spend their money on stupid things instead of saving for healthcare issues.

I agree. I have always thought that poverty is largely a state of mind, and not a state of finances. There are some important counterexamples. But for the most part I think it is true.

 

[Pandora]

By Pocket's "logic", that's all the more reason to take it away from them.

Haha Maybe we should try it. Take all the money from the rich. Including those freaks in hollywierd. I would love that then give it to everyone on welfare and wait 5 years

 

[Pandora]

I agree. I have always thought that poverty is largely a state of mind, and not a state of finances. There are some important counterexamples. But for the most part I think it is true.

Look how we are on the opposite side of politics but agree so often.

You and me should go run congress

 

[Lagboltz]

Look how we are on the opposite side of politics but agree so often.

You and me should go run congress

Naw, as soon as we get on the congressional floor we will start bickering like there is no tomorrow.

 

[GenSeneca]

I agree. I have always thought that poverty is largely a state of mind, and not a state of finances. There are some important counterexamples. But for the most part I think it is true.

We can certainly agree on this. If you make responsible decisions, you can live well on very little money.

 

[Pandora]

Naw, as soon as we get on the congressional floor we will start bickering like there is no tomorrow.

I would hope not but probably true

 

[Lagboltz]

Look how we are on the opposite side of politics but agree so often.

You and me should go run congress

This is what I think the real problem between Dems and Repubs. There will always be a significant percent of people (10% ??) that have a poverty mind and will waste all their money and time on gambling, drugs, gang warfare, etc. What do we do with these people. Does the country have any obligation? Repubs often answer NO, but I say we should give them some very minimal livelihood so they won't steal, overcrowd our jails, and beg in the streets. I feel sorry for them but the job of changing them is overwhelming. So we should try to do something just to keep them off our backs.