Kelly
Well-Known Member
Ok, for all you Atheists out there: Let's hear your argument against the existence of God. For those of you believers: why should/shouldn't God/religion play a part in politics???
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Prove that God doesn't exist.
- Thread starter Kelly
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Lindsay
Well-Known Member
Prove that God does exist.
ArmChair General
Well-Known Member
Prove that Zues doesn't exist.
vyo476
Well-Known Member
Belief in "God" is just that - belief. Here's what dictionary.com has to say about the word "belief":
1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat.
2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief.
3. confidence; faith; trust: a child's belief in his parents.
4. a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith: the Christian belief.
Personally, I like 2 and 3 the most, because they reveal the real meaning of the word - faith or confidence in something that isn't immediately provable.
Prove that God exists? Prove that God doesn't exist? Please. Neither is possible.
1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat.
2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief.
3. confidence; faith; trust: a child's belief in his parents.
4. a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith: the Christian belief.
Personally, I like 2 and 3 the most, because they reveal the real meaning of the word - faith or confidence in something that isn't immediately provable.
Prove that God exists? Prove that God doesn't exist? Please. Neither is possible.
Cheshire Cat
Well-Known Member
Which god do you mean?
Lindsay
Well-Known Member
General, vyo and Cheshire, the three of you just brought a smile to my face.
Kelly
Well-Known Member
Lindsay: 1. Modern science demonstrates that everything (solid matter, stars, planets, us, etc.) in the Universe originated from dust particles. The dust particles came together by gravity, formed planets, so fourth. Therefore, who/what set the particles into their first motion (gravitational pull towards each other)? We can't say gravity, because the particles had to be formed first before they could pull toward one of another. Basically, what I'm asking is what created something out of nothing? Nothing (that we know of) can create something out of nothing, yet we exist. Things don't just appear from nowhere naturally. Things haven't existed forever because we live in finite time. Therefore, SOMETHING actively had to form us, the World, everything. Something had to have an intention to form the first particles from nothing because that doesn't happen as part of the natural process. That 'something,' we call God, Allah, the Divine Being, Etc.
2. We live in a world of cause and effect. Who/what was the first cause? Who/what was the first effect. There cannot be an effect without a cause or vise versa. Therefore, we, the World, etc. had to be placed into existence to be affected. But, furthermore, there HAD to be a first cause. That 'first cause' is God.
Hopefully, these two argument can prove to you that God, in fact does exist. If not, say why and I've got a few more. I've NEVER heard an argument that can debunk these two points. Points like this are why astrophysicists, biologists, scientists of all types believe (rather KNOW) of God's existence. I'm not saying all scientists believe in God, I hope that's obvious. Also, I'm largely paraphrasing Aristotle and Aquinas in my points--I didn't just think this stuff up on my own although I wish I could say I did.
2. We live in a world of cause and effect. Who/what was the first cause? Who/what was the first effect. There cannot be an effect without a cause or vise versa. Therefore, we, the World, etc. had to be placed into existence to be affected. But, furthermore, there HAD to be a first cause. That 'first cause' is God.
Hopefully, these two argument can prove to you that God, in fact does exist. If not, say why and I've got a few more. I've NEVER heard an argument that can debunk these two points. Points like this are why astrophysicists, biologists, scientists of all types believe (rather KNOW) of God's existence. I'm not saying all scientists believe in God, I hope that's obvious. Also, I'm largely paraphrasing Aristotle and Aquinas in my points--I didn't just think this stuff up on my own although I wish I could say I did.
Cheshire Cat
Well-Known Member
And what actively formed your god? I think it was the EXTRA-SUPER-GOD that created him.
Lindsay
Well-Known Member
But who's to say that this one figure did it all alone? The greeks and romans had a more believable religion (to me) believing that different gods controlled different areas. I'm not an atheist, I tend to lean towards being agnostic, meaning that I don't believe the theory of God can be proven, nor disproven. But you asked to prove he doesn't exist, and I asked to prove that he does. You proved why you believe he does. Therefore I respect you as a ?Christian? Being agnostic, I'm a questioner, as well as a doubter.
"Man has always speculated upon the origin of the universe, including himself. I feel, with Herbert Spencer, that whether the universe had an origin-- and if it had-- what the origin is will never be known by man. The Christian says that the universe could not make itself; that there must have been some higher power to call it into being. Christians have been obsessed for many years by Paley's argument that if a person passing through a desert should find a watch and examine its spring, its hands, its case and its crystal, he would at once be satisfied that some intelligent being capable of design had made the watch. No doubt this is true. No civilized man would question that someone made the watch. The reason he would not doubt it is because he is familiar with watches and other appliances made by man. The savage was once unfamiliar with a watch and would have had no idea upon the subject. There are plenty of crystals and rocks of natural formation that are as intricate as a watch, but even to intelligent man they carry no implication that some intelligent power must have made them. They carry no such implication because no one has any knowledge or experience of someone having made these natural objects which everywhere abound.
To say that God made the universe gives us no explanation of the beginnings of things. If we are told that God made the universe, the question immediately arises: Who made God? Did he always exist, or was there some power back of that? Did he create matter out of nothing, or is his existence coextensive with matter? The problem is still there. What is the origin of it all? If, on the other hand, one says that the universe was not made by God, that it always existed, he has the same difficulty to confront. To say that the universe was here last year, or millions of years ago, does not explain its origin. This is still a mystery. As to the question of the origin of things, man can only wonder and doubt and guess."--Clarence Darrow.
http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/clarence_darrow/why_i_am_an_agnostic.html
"Man has always speculated upon the origin of the universe, including himself. I feel, with Herbert Spencer, that whether the universe had an origin-- and if it had-- what the origin is will never be known by man. The Christian says that the universe could not make itself; that there must have been some higher power to call it into being. Christians have been obsessed for many years by Paley's argument that if a person passing through a desert should find a watch and examine its spring, its hands, its case and its crystal, he would at once be satisfied that some intelligent being capable of design had made the watch. No doubt this is true. No civilized man would question that someone made the watch. The reason he would not doubt it is because he is familiar with watches and other appliances made by man. The savage was once unfamiliar with a watch and would have had no idea upon the subject. There are plenty of crystals and rocks of natural formation that are as intricate as a watch, but even to intelligent man they carry no implication that some intelligent power must have made them. They carry no such implication because no one has any knowledge or experience of someone having made these natural objects which everywhere abound.
To say that God made the universe gives us no explanation of the beginnings of things. If we are told that God made the universe, the question immediately arises: Who made God? Did he always exist, or was there some power back of that? Did he create matter out of nothing, or is his existence coextensive with matter? The problem is still there. What is the origin of it all? If, on the other hand, one says that the universe was not made by God, that it always existed, he has the same difficulty to confront. To say that the universe was here last year, or millions of years ago, does not explain its origin. This is still a mystery. As to the question of the origin of things, man can only wonder and doubt and guess."--Clarence Darrow.
http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/clarence_darrow/why_i_am_an_agnostic.html
Are you going to debate her or demonstrate what a buffoon you are?
Cheshire Cat
Well-Known Member
Glad to be of service to you.
Now, back to the subject.
I just discovered that Flacca is the binding ingredient that keeps the solar system from disappearing.
Kelly, prove that Flacca doesn't exist.
Cheshire Cat
Well-Known Member
It is generally accepted that the burden of proof relies upon the one making the claim. Prove I'm a buffoon.
Cheshire Cat
Well-Known Member
Actually I'm a striped pink pussy, don't you see my avatar?
Or are you blind as well as stupid?
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ArmChair General
Well-Known Member
Sounds like your the buffoon to me.
If God Created the Universe, what created God. Its a valid question.
