Social Security - Cost of living

[BigRob]

That explains a lot. I have underwear older than that. I have see it. I have lived it. He has read about it. I have been wasting my time. Old people will understand what I am saying. I am out of here.

What a compelling argument!

I can't say I blame you for not wanting the free ride to end...courtesy of MY tax dollars. What planet are you on that a system that will be bankrupt when when I retire (after paying in my entire life) is a good idea?

 

[Openmind]

That is really not even true....



I saw in some studies as well, the water prior to any drilling already had methane in it, and could be burned as well.

Also, the fracturing occurs well below the aquifer and is separated from groundwater and drinking water supplies by hundreds or thousands of feet of solid rock.

Finally, as someone who has land that is currently being drilled on, with this system, we did a ton of research into the process, and a lot of the things politicians say about it comes from a lack of understanding of the process, rather than any actual problem.

Obviously you would reject any facts that would say otherwise!
You are a good guy. . .so you couldn't live with yourself if you had to accept the fact that your money comes from something that is disastrous for the enviroment and for people's life.

Some don't have those concerns. . .they know what they're doing, but they don't care, and they are more than happy to provide tainted data to "smooth over" the concerns of good guys' conscience!

 

[Openmind]

That explains a lot. I have underwear older than that. I have see it. I have lived it. He has read about it. I have been wasting my time. Old people will understand what I am saying. I am out of here.

No, please don't go!

Rob is one of the good guys, misguided, maybe, but his intentions are good, and I think he is really trying to be fair. . . it's just so hard to come to the reality of things.

We, old people, need to retain a voice.

 

[Openmind]

You really need to educate yourself on everything. No such thing is occurring. You have once again accepted a lie by the radical left.

Any company that illegally pollutes the environment in this country faces huge fines, imprisonment of it's executives, and can be forced to close. To not know this, proves you have been fooled again.

By your "thinking," American industry is polluting the land on par with what occurred decades ago before Nixon enacted pollution laws and the EPA. You are stuck in 1970 when your left wing ancestors claimed Lake Erie was dead for a 1,000 years due to pollution...yet the Lake is alive and well...and has been for some time now.

Sure! All that is in the past, right?

How about this one in 2008: (just one out of many, by the way)

1. Tennessee Coal Ash Spill

Image credit: United Mountain Defense

Just when everybody thought the Exxon Valdez was the worst human-caused environmental disaster in U.S. history, a massive coal waste spill unleashed over a billion gallons of toxic sludge in Kingston, Tennessee. On December 22nd, 2008, a wall holding back 80 acres of sludge from the Tennessee Valley Authority’s Fossil Plant gave way, pouring coal sludge – a byproduct of the ash from coal combustion – onto at least 300 acres of surrounding land. 15 homes were destroyed, and many more sit on land that is now contaminated with arsenic, mercury and lead.

TVA and state inspection reports show that the Tennessee Valley Authority knew for the past decade about leaks at the ash retention pond and failed to act. Worse yet, they failed to warn citizens about the dangers. 8 days after the spill occurred, TVA finally shed some light on just how serious the situation really was:

“In just one year, the plant’s byproducts included 45,000 pounds of arsenic, 49,000 pounds of lead, 1.4 million pounds of barium, 91,000 pounds of chromium and 140,000 pounds of manganese. Those metals can cause cancer, liver damage and neurological complications, among other health problems. And the holding pond … contained many decades’ worth of these deposits.”

Still, even as workers protected by HAZMAT suits picked through the sludge, the residents whose homes were affected by the spill were being told by TVA that they were safe. Meanwhile, TVA was arresting activists who were trying to warn citizens of the area about the dangers.

Despite their obvious culpability, the Tennessee Valley Authority is now seeking to have all resulting lawsuits against them dismissed. The utility believes that their own responsibility is to clean up the spill, not to pay damages to those who were affected by it. TVA has bought 71 properties tainted by the spill but rejected 166 more claims.

It will likely be many years before the public knows the full extent of the damage of this coal ash spill, but it has called attention to the lack of coal ash regulation and as a result, the EPA has finally indicated plans to get tougher on coal.

Tagged as: Corporations, Disaster, Earth Day, Environment, Jerkass

.

 

[BigRob]

Obviously you would reject any facts that would say otherwise!

I did not reject those "facts", the United States government rejected those claims as unsubstantiated.

You are a good guy. . .so you couldn't live with yourself if you had to accept the fact that your money comes from something that is disastrous for the enviroment and for people's life.

We were doing fine before the oil/gas etc running timber sales etc...If anything, I would think the actual landowners would be more inclined to be sure it was safe, because no one wants their land ruined.

Some don't have those concerns. . .they know what they're doing, but they don't care, and they are more than happy to provide tainted data to "smooth over" the concerns of good guys' conscience!

Is that what our government did in this case in your opinion?

 

[BigRob]

Sure! All that is in the past, right?

How about this one in 2008: (just one out of many, by the way)

TVA is owned by the US government...so this specific example might not convey the message you are trying to convey.

That said, it is no surprise they want the lawsuits thrown out, but it is equally no surprise that those effected by this have filed them. That is why we have courts. Unless there is more to this story (which is possible), TVA is going to ultimately have to pay damages.

 

[Lagboltz]

So we are to believe that the HUGE OMNIPRESENT Federal government with it's numerous agencies and unlimited power is looking the other way while Pennsylvania is overwhelmed with pollution. That the EPA (now an enormous agency with dictatorial powers) under a socialist president is not doing it's job.

Yes. We are to believe that.
This is a government website that says the Safe Drink Water act does not apply to fracking. (Except diesel fuel)

"While the Safe Drinking Water Act (SDWA) specifically excludes hydraulic fracturing from UIC regulation under SDWA § 1421 (d)(1), the use of diesel fuel during hydraulic fracturing is still regulated by the UIC program."​

That the numerous greenie groups with considerable financial backing are not lobbying the government to stop this horrendous polluting of the land.

Yes, We are to believe that too.

"Concern for the rivers feeding the state prompted the New Jersey legislature to pass a ban on fracking by a robust vote of 33-1 in the state’s Senate, and 58-11 in the Assembly"​

"New York has operated under an effective fracking ban for the past few years, while it awaits an environmental impact study."​

About 500 people showed up at the Capitol April 2011 for anti-fracking rally organized by environmental groups.

Gipper, you really should listen to NPR and not rely totally on Fox to get your information. You should not rant about something you are ignorant of. It results in lack of respect for anything you might say in the future.

Reread GenSeneca's rule #2.

 

[Openmind]

TVA is owned by the US government...so this specific example might not convey the message you are trying to convey.

That said, it is no surprise they want the lawsuits thrown out, but it is equally no surprise that those effected by this have filed them. That is why we have courts. Unless there is more to this story (which is possible), TVA is going to ultimately have to pay damages.

So what? It is owned by the US Government. . .and it had a history of ignoring the regulations under Bush's administration. . who I am sure was more than happy to "close their eyes!"

This just demonstrate that we need a STRONG regulatory committee.

And, paying for damages may help some people. . . it doesn't fix the problem.

By the way, the "for profit" corporations too often prefer to take the risk to "get caught" because the fine they pay for poluting is much lower than the financial reward they get from ignoring the regulations and poluting (even if they do get caught!)

 

[BigRob]

So what? It is owned by the US Government. . .and it had a history of ignoring the regulations under Bush's administration. . who I am sure was more than happy to "close their eyes!"

This just demonstrate that we need a STRONG regulatory committee.

And, paying for damages may help some people. . . it doesn't fix the problem.

By the way, the "for profit" corporations too often prefer to take the risk to "get caught" because the fine they pay for poluting is much lower than the financial reward they get from ignoring the regulations and poluting (even if they do get caught!)

All we need to do it is enforce current regulations....not create committee after committee to impose more than don't make any sense.

 

[Lagboltz]

All we need to do it is enforce current regulations....not create committee after committee to impose more than don't make any sense.

I think everyone can agree with that. The difference of opinion is what types of regulations do make sense that are not already on the books, and should be.

 

[Openmind]

I think everyone can agree with that. The difference of opinion is what types of regulations do make sense that are not already on the books, and should be.

Yep! Get rid of silly regulations, keep the good ones, add some necessary ones, and MAKE SURE the law has enough teeth that infractions of regulations actually HURTS more in the pocket of big Corps (and for longer periods) than complying with the regulations would!

 

[dahermit]

Does this mean you are emigrating to Cuba?

I think you can still get your SS check there. I hear the American dollar still goes a long way there. You will need to spruce up on your Spanish.

I know of a Florida entrepreneur who owns a rickety boat. He will gladly transport you across the Florida Straits to the utopia that is Cuba...for a price. If you need money for the crossing, I will happily contribute.

I am out of here, fool. This child's social forum. Not the U.S.
But then, how much are you willing to contribute?

 

[Gipper]

I am out of here, fool. This child's social forum. Not the U.S.
But then, how much are you willing to contribute?

Oh too bad. I had such high hopes that you might be leaving the country.

Why is it you libs who hate the country and want to transform it into a socialist sh*thole always refuse to leave? There are lots of sh*tty socialist nations out there. There has to be one to your liking.

My buddy in Florida with the rickety boat charges $1,000 to get you into Cuba illegally. Problem is he is forced to drop you 7 miles from shore. Can you swim the rest of the way?

 

[Pandora]

Oh too bad. I had such high hopes that you might be leaving the country.

Why is it you libs who hate the country and want to transform it into a socialist sh*thole always refuse to leave? There are lots of sh*tty socialist nations out there. There has to be one to your liking.

My buddy in Florida with the rickety boat charges $1,000 to get you into Cuba illegally. Problem is he is forced to drop you 7 miles from shore. Can you swim the rest of the way?

Is that a joke or are there really people willing to pay to get into cuba?

 

[Gipper]

Yes. We are to believe that.
This is a government website that says the Safe Drink Water act does not apply to fracking. (Except diesel fuel)

"While the Safe Drinking Water Act (SDWA) specifically excludes hydraulic fracturing from UIC regulation under SDWA § 1421 (d)(1), the use of diesel fuel during hydraulic fracturing is still regulated by the UIC program."​

Yes, We are to believe that too.

"Concern for the rivers feeding the state prompted the New Jersey legislature to pass a ban on fracking by a robust vote of 33-1 in the state’s Senate, and 58-11 in the Assembly"​

"New York has operated under an effective fracking ban for the past few years, while it awaits an environmental impact study."​

About 500 people showed up at the Capitol April 2011 for anti-fracking rally organized by environmental groups.

Gipper, you really should listen to NPR and not rely totally on Fox to get your information. You should not rant about something you are ignorant of. It results in lack of respect for anything you might say in the future.

Reread GenSeneca's rule #2.

You make a lot of assumptions don't you?

Your first mistake is listening to NPR.

Fracking is subject to all sorts of regulations. If an oil and gas company pollutes water used by humans they will be subject to numerous lawsuits...and currently many lawsuits are in the works. Some states are taking action now and the EPA is monitoring fracking operations closely.

So quit screaming the sky is falling...just because the radical left tells you to.

You claim water treatment plants have been contaminated by fracking. This is absurd. If this were so, the oil and gas company responsible would face heavy fines and shut down. You really think water treatment plants can't treat the water because of fracking chemicals resulting in them releasing contaminated drinking water to their customers?

Years ago I had a client that polluted a river accidentally. The river was a source of drinking water by a municipal water treatment plant. He was heavily fined and some of his operation permits were cancelled. He paid to clean up the damage to the treatment plant. He incurred huge costs which nearly closed his business. You pollute...you pay...and I can assure you I know a lot more about this subject than you do...listening to NPR just makes one stupid.

Polluting drinking water in the USA is a crime that will cost you dearly. Companies spend huge amounts of money and implement numerous policies and procedures to make sure it does not happen.

You cite one act as if that means fracking operations can freely pollute. Nothing could be further from the truth.